| | | Author | Message |
|---|
DummyP
  
| | #1 posted May 30, 2009 at 6:25pm (EST) |
me
--
 | thegill321
 
| #41 posted June 1, 2009 at 7:43pm (EST)
edited June 1, 2009 at 7:44pm (EST) |
Wii wrote:
> Of course then there is players like Kornwall, who sits and waits
> for players to not be looking before he has the balls to hit them.
OH STFU. if you knew anything about hockey, you know that youre not supposed to look directly down when skating up-ice. that was a completely legal hit on havlat.
edit: and this is STANLEY CUP discussion, not conference finals discussion. | Ghaleon
 
| | #42 posted June 1, 2009 at 8:00pm (EST) |
thegill321 wrote:
> Wii wrote:
>> Of course then there is players like Kornwall, who sits and waits
>> for players to not be looking before he has the balls to hit them.
>
> OH STFU. if you knew anything about hockey, you know that youre not
> supposed to look directly down when skating up-ice. that was a completely
> legal hit on havlat.
>
> edit: and this is STANLEY CUP discussion, not conference finals discussion.
Fudge off. I'll discuss whatever I feel like.
He didn't touch the puck. The call on the ice was legit. It was a illegal hit. Kornwall is known for his hits, and most are dirty. | Mendo
| | #43 posted June 1, 2009 at 8:09pm (EST) |
Ahh the Stanley Cup. Crazy to see Pittsburgh and Detroit have at it again but Detroit will win.
Pittsburgh has no chance in hell. Arguing about who is injured and who isn’t is pretty pointless. A team wins by the depth they have.
While Pittsburgh is pretty solid (and showed it to get this far), Detroit is just too much. Every line is a threat, just watch the way they move the puck.
I really like Malkin, and i wont even beef on him for getting into a scrap. He is a team player and was just doing it to get his guys into the game. Too little to late though, he’s going to have lots of opportunities to hoist the cup in his future..... just not this year.
| mentalpowers
| | #44 posted June 1, 2009 at 8:10pm (EST) |
The worst news for Pittsburgh is that Detroit has been without the best player in the NHL.. | Ghaleon
| | #45 posted June 1, 2009 at 8:19pm (EST) |
mentalpowers wrote:
> The worst news for Pittsburgh is that Detroit has been without the
> best player in the NHL..
Crosby plays for Detroit? Since when? | mentalpowers
| | #46 posted June 1, 2009 at 8:27pm (EST) |
Ha. Crosby. . . | thegill321
| | #47 posted June 1, 2009 at 8:30pm (EST) |
Wii wrote:
> thegill321 wrote:
>> Wii wrote:
> |>> Of course then there is players like Kornwall, who sits and waits
> |>> for players to not be looking before he has the balls to hit them.
>>
>> OH STFU. if you knew anything about hockey, you know that youre
> not
>> supposed to look directly down when skating up-ice. that was a
> completely
>> legal hit on havlat.
>>
>> edit: and this is STANLEY CUP discussion, not conference finals
> discussion.
>
> Fudge off. I'll discuss whatever I feel like.
>
> He didn't touch the puck. The call on the ice was legit. It was a
> illegal hit. Kornwall is known for his hits, and most are dirty.
the puck was down between his legs one second before he got lit up. | Ghaleon
| | #48 posted June 1, 2009 at 9:50pm (EST) |
http://www.nhl.com/ice/page.htm?id=26348
Pick: A “pick” is the action of a player or goalkeeper who checks an opponent who is not in possession of the puck and is unaware of the impending check/hit. A player who is aware of an impending hit, not deemed to be a legal “battle for the puck,” may not be interfered with by a player or goalkeeper delivering a “pick.” A player or goalkeeper delivering a “pick” is one who moves into an opponent’s path without initially having body position, thereby taking him out of the play. When this is done, an interference penalty shall be assessed.
Only reason he wasn't suspended, is that headshots aren't against the rules in the NHL, yet.
He didn't have control of the puck. Only defense Kornwall could have and I would agree, he couldn't of known that. It looked like he did from a players view on the ice. | Mendo
| | #49 posted June 1, 2009 at 10:43pm (EST) |
The hit was a little iffy, but keep in mind that Kornwall is the type of player they expect to lay out some big hits to shift momentum. In no way am I condoning such actions but it is what it is. I hate to see players go down hurt but as a player you have a duty to keep your head up and expect impact. If you don’t, you are only setting yourself up. | bigdoug616
| | #50 posted June 2, 2009 at 12:13am (EST) |
I hate hockey, but im gonna say wings in 4...yes a sweep! | Ghaleon
| | #51 posted June 2, 2009 at 3:06am (EST) |
Guy wrote:
> The hit was a little iffy, but keep in mind that Kornwall is the type
> of player they expect to lay out some big hits to shift momentum.
> In no way am I condoning such actions but it is what it is. I hate
> to see players go down hurt but as a player you have a duty to keep
> your head up and expect impact. If you don’t, you are only setting
> yourself up.
Big hits are fine. If he didn't aim for the head, no one would care about the hit. Hockey is the only profession sport that doesn't have a rule against headshots. Even the freaking NFL has one, a full contact sport.
In Game 2 I think, he tried to get Malkin. He ducked and Kornwall flew OVER him, feet in the air.
He hits the way Stevens used too, boarderline dirty, but within the rules most of the time. Karma catches up eventually, just look how Stevens went out. | DarkLord
 
| | #52 posted June 2, 2009 at 12:30pm (EST) |
Wii wrote:
> mentalpowers wrote:
>> The worst news for Pittsburgh is that Detroit has been without
> the
>> best player in the NHL..
>
> Crosby plays for Detroit? Since when?
Detroit has been without one of their best players "Datsyuk" due to injury. Pittsburgh has been without their best player "Crosby" due to him not doing anything. DUUUUUUUUUUUUURRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR
  | thegill321
| | #53 posted June 2, 2009 at 12:55pm (EST) |
DarkLord wrote:
> Wii wrote:
>> mentalpowers wrote:
> |>> The worst news for Pittsburgh is that Detroit has been without
>> the
> |>> best player in the NHL..
>>
>> Crosby plays for Detroit? Since when?
>
> Detroit has been without one of their best players "Datsyuk" due to
> injury. Pittsburgh has been without their best player "Crosby" due
> to him not doing anything. DUUUUUUUUUUUUURRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR
>
+1 for you Darklord. | Ghaleon
| | #54 posted June 2, 2009 at 5:55pm (EST) |
DarkLord wrote:
> Wii wrote:
>> mentalpowers wrote:
> |>> The worst news for Pittsburgh is that Detroit has been without
>> the
> |>> best player in the NHL..
>>
>> Crosby plays for Detroit? Since when?
>
> Detroit has been without one of their best players "Datsyuk" due to
> injury. Pittsburgh has been without their best player "Crosby" due
> to him not doing anything. DUUUUUUUUUUUUURRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR
>
>
Have you watched anything but Detroit games this year?
DUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUURRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR?
The best series this year was Washington vs Pittsburgh.
I would also suggest rereading what he wrote. To call Datsyuk better than Crosby is laughable, DUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUURRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR! | Ghaleon
| | #55 posted June 2, 2009 at 9:01pm (EST) |
Decent first period. I still think it will be over in 5 or 6 for Detroit. | TrueBlue
 
| | #56 posted June 2, 2009 at 9:07pm (EST) |
good game so far. I'm rooting for penguins only cause i dont want to see Detroit win it again. But im a Rangers fan. | Picktor
(frozen)
| | #57 posted June 2, 2009 at 9:27pm (EST) |
DarkLord wrote:
> Wii wrote:
>> mentalpowers wrote:
> |>> The worst news for Pittsburgh is that Detroit has been without
>> the
> |>> best player in the NHL..
>>
>> Crosby plays for Detroit? Since when?
>
> Detroit has been without one of their best players "Datsyuk" due to
> injury. Pittsburgh has been without their best player "Crosby" due
> to him not doing anything. DUUUUUUUUUUUUURRRRRRRRRRRRRRRR
>
>
Not to mention Datsyuk is surrounded by the best roster in the NHL arguably. Its just like football, you put a good player in with a amazing line, that player is going to do amazing. Dont even put Datsyuk in the same sentence with Crosby.....
 | mentalpowers
| | #58 posted June 2, 2009 at 10:11pm (EST) |
Crosby absolutely isn't the best player in the league. Datsyuk might not be either, but it's as laughable to say that Crosby is. There's a lot more to being a great hockey player than being in the national spotlight. Defense is one of those things. | OuTrAgE
  
| | #59 posted June 2, 2009 at 10:40pm (EST) |
mentalpowers wrote:
> Crosby absolutely isn't the best player in the league.
> Datsyuk might not be either, but it's as laughable to say
> that Crosby is. There's a lot more to being a great hockey
> player than being in the national spotlight. Defense is
> one of those things.
How is it laughable to say Crosby is the best player... he is. Many experts agree. Granted I don't think it's laughable to think Datsyuk is the best (even though I don't think so ).
Crosby is solid defensively. But, he also has speed, strength, incredible vision, and great hands.
But, the Pens won so I'm happy.
 | DarkLord
| | #60 posted June 2, 2009 at 11:19pm (EST) |
i never said Datsyuk was the best, he's the best on his team though, just like Crosby is. We all know that Ovechkin is the best player in the league.
I mean, really, it should be Capitals vs Red Wings right now. BUT, the Caps had Varlamov & Theodore...if they had a decent goalie, the Pens wouldn't be playing right now.
| OuTrAgE
| | #61 posted June 2, 2009 at 11:24pm (EST) |
DarkLord wrote:
> i never said Datsyuk was the best, he's the best on his
> team though, just like Crosby is. We all know that Ovechkin
> is the best player in the league.
>
> I mean, really, it should be Capitals vs Red Wings right
> now. BUT, the Caps had Varlamov & Theodore...if they had
> a decent goalie, the Pens wouldn't be playing right now.
>
>
I'm guessing you didn't watch much of the Caps this offseason... Varlamov played amazingly.
| DarkLord
| | #62 posted June 2, 2009 at 11:28pm (EST) |
well yeah. They made it to the fudging conference finals. but did you honestly think that Varlamov could win the Stanley Cup this year? Did you think that Varlamov could beat the Penguins? (even though he almost did.) I ask those same 2 questions about Theodore too. That's why the Caps are done this year.
| OuTrAgE
| | #63 posted June 2, 2009 at 11:37pm (EST) |
First off, the Caps weren't in the Conference Finals...
Secondly, your point is pretty pointless. The Pens beat the Caps because they were a better TEAM (you do understand what a team is, right?). The Caps are done because the Penguins were better.
| Picktor
(frozen)
| | #64 posted June 3, 2009 at 12:01am (EST) |
mentalpowers wrote:
> Crosby absolutely isn't the best player in the league. Datsyuk might
> not be either, but it's as laughable to say that Crosby is. There's
> a lot more to being a great hockey player than being in the national
> spotlight. Defense is one of those things.
Crosby has earned the Art Ross Trophy, the Hart Memorial Trophy and the Lester Pearson award. He is the youngest and sole teen in history to win a scoring title in a North American Hockey League. He has earned scoring titles and awards that havent been awarded to a player of his age since Gretzky. He is the true first, since Lemieux to even be put in the same league as "The Great One". He is also the youngest Team Captain in NHL history.
I'm sorry but if you are such a horrible critic to not recognize the dynasty that Crosby is creating, you should stop watching hockey or pretending to have an opinion.
| DarkLord
| | #65 posted June 3, 2009 at 12:38am (EST) |
OuTrAgE wrote:
> First off, the Caps weren't in the Conference Finals...
>
> Secondly, your point is pretty pointless. The Pens beat the Caps
> because they were a better TEAM (you do understand what a team is,
> right?). The Caps are done because the Penguins were better.
>
holy crap....i totally forgot about the Hurricanes! haha, poor Carolina, that series was over so fast I forgot all about it! And no, I have no ida what a team is. the Pens weren't that much better than the Caps either, otherwise, it would not have gone to 7 games. Just like the Wings and the Ducks. Detroit was barely better than the Ducks.
| DarkLord
| | #66 posted June 3, 2009 at 12:44am (EST) |
Admiral wrote:
> Bunch of Crosby/Pens haters. That's all this is.
I don't hate either of them. I just hate it when people try and say that they are better than Detroit. Granted, the Pens could win the Cup and prove me wrong, but I doubt it. Pittsburgh is not going to win 3 of the last 4 games. Anyone who likes hockey is lucky though, because the best two teams in the league are fighting for the greatest trophy in the world. That cannot be argued. But, at least at this point and time, Pittsburgh is #2. And as much as I hate to say this...they are more of a #1.5
| Grimlock
| | #67 posted June 3, 2009 at 12:47am (EST) |
If they were a 1.5, they would be tied in the series. Remains yet to be seen, but they haven't been drastically outplayed in any game and I would go as far as to say that both teams had their chances in all three games.. Anything is possible, and this is still a series. Let's see what happens on Thursday.
GENO | DarkLord
| #68 posted June 3, 2009 at 12:54am (EST)
edited June 3, 2009 at 12:55am (EST) |
yeah, it could very well be a 3-game series after Thursday night...i hope not though, haha.
fudging Malkin too...i wish he was playing like he was last year (as in, not doing anything...but no, he has to have a point on every Pens goal)
| mentalpowers
| #69 posted June 3, 2009 at 6:24am (EST)
edited June 3, 2009 at 7:31am (EST) |
Admiral wrote:
> mentalpowers wrote:
>> Crosby absolutely isn't the best player in the league. Datsyuk
> might
>> not be either, but it's as laughable to say that Crosby is. There's
>> a lot more to being a great hockey player than being in the national
>> spotlight. Defense is one of those things.
>
> So who puts up the offense that Crosby does, and also plays solid
> defense like he does? Nobody.
Really? Datsyuk is the reigning Selke Trophy award winner (best defensive forward) and he was nominated again this year. Datsyuk had 6 fewer points than Crosby. So the answer to your question is Datsyuk. He puts up comparable offensive numbers while playing superior defense and playing more disciplined hockey, putting his team in shorthanded situations less frequently.
I don't think it's laughable to say that Crosby's the best in the league. I don't think he is, though. He's certainly elite, top 5 without a doubt and almost surely top 3. I don't understand why you guys seem to think I view him as a chump.
Edit: Nevermind. I looked back at my first couple posts and it's pretty obvious why you'd think I find it laughable. I was extremely unclear in that "Ha. Crosby. . ." post. I meant to express laughter at the wise-ass response I got to my first comment, not that it's laughable that Crosby be considered the best in the league. I would've inferred the same thing you guys did. So to clarify, I can understand considering Crosby to be the best. I don't think he is. I consider Datsyuk and Ovechkin better, personally. | mentalpowers
| | #70 posted June 3, 2009 at 7:40am (EST) |
Picktor wrote:
> mentalpowers wrote:
>> Crosby absolutely isn't the best player in the league. Datsyuk
> might
>> not be either, but it's as laughable to say that Crosby is. There's
>> a lot more to being a great hockey player than being in the national
>> spotlight. Defense is one of those things.
>
> Crosby has earned the Art Ross Trophy, the Hart Memorial Trophy and
> the Lester Pearson award. He is the youngest and sole teen in history
> to win a scoring title in a North American Hockey League. He has
> earned scoring titles and awards that havent been awarded to a player
> of his age since Gretzky. He is the true first, since Lemieux to
> even be put in the same league as "The Great One". He is also the
> youngest Team Captain in NHL history.
>
> I'm sorry but if you are such a horrible critic to not recognize the
> dynasty that Crosby is creating, you should stop watching hockey or
> pretending to have an opinion.
>
>
Haha. I love the personal insults; they really validate your points.
Crosby is a great player. He and Malkin are two of the top offensive players in the game, obviously. I don't know why you think I can't recognize the semi-dynasty that those two are creating together. I only say semi-dynasty because they need to win a few Cups before they're a true dynasty in my eyes. They've pretty clearly established themselves as major players in the East. As long as management doesn't fudge things up, they should be a powerhouse for years.
Please fabricate some more bogus stances for me to have so you can tell me what not to do. Thanks in advance. | thehulk75
| | #71 posted June 3, 2009 at 9:21am (EST) |
The wings will take it in 5. | BluePhoenix
| | #72 posted June 3, 2009 at 9:53pm (EST) |
Federov still play? how bout that Mike Modano | Picktor
(frozen)
| | #73 posted June 3, 2009 at 11:20pm (EST) |
mentalpowers wrote:
> Picktor wrote:
>> mentalpowers wrote:
> |>> Crosby absolutely isn't the best player in the league. Datsyuk
>> might
> |>> not be either, but it's as laughable to say that Crosby is. There's
> |>> a lot more to being a great hockey player than being in the national
> |>> spotlight. Defense is one of those things.
>>
>> Crosby has earned the Art Ross Trophy, the Hart Memorial Trophy
> and
>> the Lester Pearson award. He is the youngest and sole teen in
> history
>> to win a scoring title in a North American Hockey League. He has
>> earned scoring titles and awards that havent been awarded to a
> player
>> of his age since Gretzky. He is the true first, since Lemieux
> to
>> even be put in the same league as "The Great One". He is also
> the
>> youngest Team Captain in NHL history.
>>
>> I'm sorry but if you are such a horrible critic to not recognize
> the
>> dynasty that Crosby is creating, you should stop watching hockey
> or
>> pretending to have an opinion.
>>
>>
>
> Haha. I love the personal insults; they really validate your points.
>
> Crosby is a great player. He and Malkin are two of the top offensive
> players in the game, obviously. I don't know why you think I can't
> recognize the semi-dynasty that those two are creating together.
> I only say semi-dynasty because they need to win a few Cups before
> they're a true dynasty in my eyes. They've pretty clearly established
> themselves as major players in the East. As long as management doesn't
> fudge things up, they should be a powerhouse for years.
So you base how many cups a player wins, on his dynasty? What part of my insult wasnt valid? lol
>
> Please fabricate some more bogus stances for me to have so you can
> tell me what not to do. Thanks in advance.
I stand by what I said. I think its laughable that you have to make up reasons on why Crosby is not the best player in the league currently (Stanley cups won, HA!). And considering how young Crosby is, and how many times he has been to the finals in his so far, early career, I think your opinion of him is a joke. Stop speculating on hockey, please.
| mentalpowers
| | #74 posted June 4, 2009 at 10:53am (EST) |
Picktor wrote:
> mentalpowers wrote:
>> Picktor wrote:
> |>> mentalpowers wrote:
>> |>> Crosby absolutely isn't the best player in the league. Datsyuk
> |>> might
>> |>> not be either, but it's as laughable to say that Crosby is.
> There's
>> |>> a lot more to being a great hockey player than being in the
> national
>> |>> spotlight. Defense is one of those things.
> |>>
> |>> Crosby has earned the Art Ross Trophy, the Hart Memorial Trophy
>> and
> |>> the Lester Pearson award. He is the youngest and sole teen in
>> history
> |>> to win a scoring title in a North American Hockey League. He
> has
> |>> earned scoring titles and awards that havent been awarded to a
>> player
> |>> of his age since Gretzky. He is the true first, since Lemieux
>> to
> |>> even be put in the same league as "The Great One". He is also
>> the
> |>> youngest Team Captain in NHL history.
> |>>
> |>> I'm sorry but if you are such a horrible critic to not recognize
>> the
> |>> dynasty that Crosby is creating, you should stop watching hockey
>> or
> |>> pretending to have an opinion.
> |>>
> |>>
>>
>> Haha. I love the personal insults; they really validate your points.
>>
>> Crosby is a great player. He and Malkin are two of the top offensive
>> players in the game, obviously. I don't know why you think I can't
>> recognize the semi-dynasty that those two are creating together.
>
>> I only say semi-dynasty because they need to win a few Cups before
>> they're a true dynasty in my eyes. They've pretty clearly established
>> themselves as major players in the East. As long as management
> doesn't
>> fudge things up, they should be a powerhouse for years.
>
> So you base how many cups a player wins, on his dynasty? What part
> of my insult wasnt valid? lol
>>
>> Please fabricate some more bogus stances for me to have so you
> can
>> tell me what not to do. Thanks in advance.
>
> I stand by what I said. I think its laughable that you have to make
> up reasons on why Crosby is not the best player in the league currently
> (Stanley cups won, HA!). And considering how young Crosby is, and
> how many times he has been to the finals in his so far, early career,
> I think your opinion of him is a joke. Stop speculating on hockey,
> please.
>
>
I must apologize, Picktor. I had been posting under the assumption that your reading comprehension was better than my dog's. Now that you've effectively proven that assumption false, I can better tailor my posts to your needs.
Dynasty=championships
The 1991-1994 Buffalo Bills were not a dynasty because they didn't win the Super Bowl. They were a great team, no doubt, but not a dynasty.
The 91-93, or even 91-98 Chicago Bulls were a dynasty because they did win NBA Championships.
Crosby Era
Perhaps by dynasty you mean the Crosby era with the Penguins. That would make sense. That's precisely why I stated: "They've pretty clearly established themselves as major players in the East. As long as management doesn't fudge things up, they should be a powerhouse for years." This statement indicates that Crosby has ushered a new era for the Pens that has placed them as true contenders.
Greatness Without Championships
Not once did I say that Crosby is not the best player in the league because he hasn't won a Cup. My point was that they don't have a dynasty, but instead, a very successful era thus far. Some of the greatest athletes have never won a championship, including, but not limited to:
Dan Marino: probably the best QB in history
John Stockton: probably the best PG in history
Ted Williams: the best or second best hitter in history.
I do not judge players' talent based on championships.
Crosby is elite
You apparently missed the part where I stated that Crosby is an elite talent. I don't hate the guy, I don't think he's bad, average, good, great; he's an elite talent. I think he's among the best in the game: probably top three, but fourth at worst.
Defense+
The main reason I don't consider Crosby the very best in the game is that Datsyuk is a better defensive player who puts up very comparable offensive numbers. I'm not making this up, either, like you seem to claim. If I value defense more than you do, that doesn't make my opinion invalid. Additional factors that make me currently favor Datsyuk: he's great at face-offs; he's been more consistent, posting +40/-6 in wins/losses compared to +32/-29 for Crosby; he does better staying out of the box
Franchise
Now, if I were to have my choice of any player in the NHL to start building a franchise around, I wouldn't even consider choosing Datsyuk. Crosby and Ovechkin would clearly be the only two up for consideration due to their immense talent and marketability.
Improvement
I also fully expect Crosby to improve and, along with Ovechkin and Malkin, be in a class of their own very soon, maybe even next season. I value what Datsyuk did this past season more than I value what Crosby did. Go back a couple years (06-07 specifically), and Crosby wins hands down. I feel that injury has cost Crosby a bit the past two seasons. He's been great despite that, but if he can become more durable and reliable, I would expect him to surpass his 06-07 and become the clear #1 in hockey. He's not back there or beyond there yet, though, in my opinion.
Summary
Have you figured out that I consider Crosby a premium talent yet? I've tried to reiterate that notion several times since you missed it before this post. I haven't speculated on hockey, but you continue to misinterpret or invent my arguments. You seem so set on my not discussing hockey as if I know less than you. Maybe I do, but you've done absolutely nothing to prove it. Your inane insults are backed by a very minimal amount of hockey knowledge or support for your belief that Crosby is the best. Feel free to convince me that Crosby is the best. | Grimlock
| | #75 posted June 4, 2009 at 11:44am (EST) |
Datsyuk plays with better, more experienced players in a deeper system. Crosby is MUCH better than Datsyuk. Hands down.
GENO | Ghaleon
| | #76 posted June 4, 2009 at 9:43pm (EST) |
One word for the past 15 minutes.
WOW!
| OuTrAgE
| | #77 posted June 4, 2009 at 9:43pm (EST) |
WOW indeed.
| Picktor
(frozen)
| | #78 posted June 4, 2009 at 9:59pm (EST) |
mentalpowers wrote:
> Picktor wrote:
>> mentalpowers wrote:
> |>> Picktor wrote:
>> |>> mentalpowers wrote:
> |>> |>> Crosby absolutely isn't the best player in the league. Datsyuk
>> |>> might
> |>> |>> not be either, but it's as laughable to say that Crosby is.
>> There's
> |>> |>> a lot more to being a great hockey player than being in the
>> national
> |>> |>> spotlight. Defense is one of those things.
>> |>>
>> |>> Crosby has earned the Art Ross Trophy, the Hart Memorial Trophy
> |>> and
>> |>> the Lester Pearson award. He is the youngest and sole teen
> in
> |>> history
>> |>> to win a scoring title in a North American Hockey League.
> He
>> has
>> |>> earned scoring titles and awards that havent been awarded to
> a
> |>> player
>> |>> of his age since Gretzky. He is the true first, since Lemieux
> |>> to
>> |>> even be put in the same league as "The Great One". He is also
> |>> the
>> |>> youngest Team Captain in NHL history.
>> |>>
>> |>> I'm sorry but if you are such a horrible critic to not recognize
> |>> the
>> |>> dynasty that Crosby is creating, you should stop watching hockey
> |>> or
>> |>> pretending to have an opinion.
>> |>>
>> |>>
> |>>
> |>> Haha. I love the personal insults; they really validate your
> points.
> |>>
> |>> Crosby is a great player. He and Malkin are two of the top offensive
> |>> players in the game, obviously. I don't know why you think I
> can't
> |>> recognize the semi-dynasty that those two are creating together.
>>
> |>> I only say semi-dynasty because they need to win a few Cups before
> |>> they're a true dynasty in my eyes. They've pretty clearly established
> |>> themselves as major players in the East. As long as management
>> doesn't
> |>> fudge things up, they should be a powerhouse for years.
>>
>> So you base how many cups a player wins, on his dynasty? What
> part
>> of my insult wasnt valid? lol
> |>>
> |>> Please fabricate some more bogus stances for me to have so you
>> can
> |>> tell me what not to do. Thanks in advance.
>>
>> I stand by what I said. I think its laughable that you have to
> make
>> up reasons on why Crosby is not the best player in the league currently
>> (Stanley cups won, HA!). And considering how young Crosby is,
> and
>> how many times he has been to the finals in his so far, early career,
>> I think your opinion of him is a joke. Stop speculating on hockey,
>> please.
>>
>>
>
> I must apologize, Picktor. I had been posting under the assumption
> that your reading comprehension was better than my dog's. Now that
> you've effectively proven that assumption false, I can better tailor
> my posts to your needs.
>
> Dynasty=championships
> The 1991-1994 Buffalo Bills were not a dynasty because they didn't
> win the Super Bowl. They were a great team, no doubt, but not a dynasty.
> The 91-93, or even 91-98 Chicago Bulls were a dynasty because they
> did win NBA Championships.
Just so I understand, and can make sense of your definitions, a dynasty is a team? Where's you compared Malkin/Crosby as a semi dynasty? I'll just assume that its an invalid point when comparing players and move on.
>
> Crosby Era
> Perhaps by dynasty you mean the Crosby era with the Penguins. That
> would make sense. That's precisely why I stated: "They've pretty
> clearly established themselves as major players in the East. As long
> as management doesn't fudge things up, they should be a powerhouse
> for years." This statement indicates that Crosby has ushered a new
> era for the Pens that has placed them as true contenders.
And I dont believe anyone has said anything about a Datsyuk era? I would say Crosby has the star power to usher any era?
>
> Greatness Without Championships
> Not once did I say that Crosby is not the best player in the league
> because he hasn't won a Cup. My point was that they don't have a
> dynasty, but instead, a very successful era thus far. Some of the
> greatest athletes have never won a championship, including, but not
> limited to:
> Dan Marino: probably the best QB in history
> John Stockton: probably the best PG in history
> Ted Williams: the best or second best hitter in history.
> I do not judge players' talent based on championships.
Again, Crosby is young, he has a long career ahead of him. Many teams have been to the finals countless times before they actually won a Championship and I believe the Pens will be no different.
>
> Crosby is elite
> You apparently missed the part where I stated that Crosby is an elite
> talent. I don't hate the guy, I don't think he's bad, average, good,
> great; he's an elite talent. I think he's among the best in the game:
> probably top three, but fourth at worst.
>
> Defense+
> The main reason I don't consider Crosby the very best in the game
> is that Datsyuk is a better defensive player who puts up very comparable
> offensive numbers. I'm not making this up, either, like you seem
> to claim. If I value defense more than you do, that doesn't make
> my opinion invalid. Additional factors that make me currently favor
> Datsyuk: he's great at face-offs; he's been more consistent, posting
> +40/-6 in wins/losses compared to +32/-29 for Crosby; he does better
> staying out of the box
What Crosby may lack in "Defense" he more than makes up for with his play maker, puck handling, and teamwork skills. Which btw greatly outweighs Datsyuk's overall abilities. Datsyuk has some of the best veterans surrounding him, comparing both of these players is very inaccurate considering the circumstances surround them.
>
> Franchise
> Now, if I were to have my choice of any player in the NHL to start
> building a franchise around, I wouldn't even consider choosing Datsyuk.
> Crosby and Ovechkin would clearly be the only two up for consideration
> due to their immense talent and marketability.
Then why are you comparing Datsyuk and Crosby at all? Franchise players= best in the league....
>
> Improvement
> I also fully expect Crosby to improve and, along with Ovechkin and
> Malkin, be in a class of their own very soon, maybe even next season.
> I value what Datsyuk did this past season more than I value what
> Crosby did. Go back a couple years (06-07 specifically), and Crosby
> wins hands down. I feel that injury has cost Crosby a bit the past
> two seasons. He's been great despite that, but if he can become more
> durable and reliable, I would expect him to surpass his 06-07 and
> become the clear #1 in hockey. He's not back there or beyond there
> yet, though, in my opinion.
>
> Summary
> Have you figured out that I consider Crosby a premium talent yet?
> I've tried to reiterate that notion several times since you missed
> it before this post. I haven't speculated on hockey, but you continue
> to misinterpret or invent my arguments. You seem so set on my not
> discussing hockey as if I know less than you. Maybe I do, but you've
> done absolutely nothing to prove it. Your inane insults are backed
> by a very minimal amount of hockey knowledge or support for your belief
> that Crosby is the best. Feel free to convince me that Crosby is
> the best.
Inane insults? I insulted your opinion of Crosby? I am simply disagreeing with you on a number of your points. If this comes off as insults then I apologize for your misinterpretation of my points. Maybe you should go cry about it?
| BluePhoenix
| | #79 posted June 4, 2009 at 10:06pm (EST) |
Dominik Hashek? Radek Bonk? Nicklaus Lindstrom? Mark Recchi? | Ghaleon
| | #80 posted June 4, 2009 at 10:56pm (EST) |
Great game. Pittsburgh was able to do to Detroit what was done to them, shut them down after getting the lead.
Best of 3 now.
The momentum has changed, from Detroit winning 2, to the Pens winning 2 in a row. | | |
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