General

Topic   Impeach Obama 2012

TheDoctor
GameTZ Gold Subscriber 1000 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader
12-Apr-2012(#2)
Someone's always trying to keep the black man down.
psx_4
GameTZ Subscriber 350 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
12-Apr-2012(#3)
That's not the issue.
thegreatest
Gold Good Trader Has Written 1 Review
12-Apr-2012(#4)
psx_4 wrote:
> That's not the issue.

What exactly is the issue then? Last I checked the DOW is higher than it has been since like 06 or something.
DaveSGE

(abuse)
12-Apr-2012(#5)
thegreatest wrote:
> psx_4 wrote:
>> That's not the issue.
>
> What exactly is the issue then? Last I checked the DOW is higher than
> it has been since like 06 or something.


And as we all know, the President controls the stock market.
thegreatest
Gold Good Trader Has Written 1 Review
* 12-Apr-2012(#6)
He may not control it, but who gets blamed for a stock market crash? The president and his administration.

Except for some reason people seem to forget that Bush was in office when it crashed and it has done nothing but go up with Obama in office.

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psx_4
GameTZ Subscriber 350 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
* 12-Apr-2012(#7)
Article I, Section 8, of the Constitution reserves exclusively for Congress the power to declare war. The president will only act as the commander-in-chief and direct the war after it is declared by Congress.
The president seeks the approval of the United Nations NOT Congress and tell congress what they already did. This violates the constitution.
Here is a video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vXomoQD8lJ8
Outinthedark
300 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally Has Written 2 Reviews
12-Apr-2012(#8)
You're a month behind. Already seen and talked about this before. Clinton was also impeached. Impeach means nothing more than to accuse. Congress is just mad Obama listened to the UN's declaration rather than them.

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DaveSGE

(abuse)
12-Apr-2012(#9)
thegreatest wrote:
> He may not control it, but who gets blamed for a stock market crash?
> The president and his administration.
>
> Except for some reason people seem to forget that Bush was in office
> when it crashed and it has done nothing but go up with Obama in office.
>
>
>

Because we all know that 9/11 did nothing but positive things for the stock market.
metsfan718
Silver Good Trader
12-Apr-2012(#10)
Fudge politics. Too much drama and propaganda to deal with.
GTZ E Cig forum:
http://gametz.com/forum/USER%3A101978

thegreatest
Gold Good Trader Has Written 1 Review
* 12-Apr-2012(#11)
DaveSGE wrote:
> thegreatest wrote:
>> He may not control it, but who gets blamed for a stock market crash?
>> The president and his administration.
>>
>> Except for some reason people seem to forget that Bush was in office
>> when it crashed and it has done nothing but go up with Obama in
> office.
>>
>> image>" class="wirc" height="140"> >" title="See this image fullsize">[full]
>>
>>
>
> Because we all know that 9/11 did nothing but positive things for
> the stock market.

A terrorist attack has no effect on the economy. Wars and banks selling loans to corporations while loaning too much money does.

People want Obama impeached because A) They don't want a black president for some reason or B) He isn't fixing what Bush did fast enough even though things are getting better. I'd like to see someone get anything done with congress having a majority from a conflicting party. Give the man a chance and see what he can get done.
Miranda
GameTZ Subscriber Quadruple Gold Good Trader
Has Written 1 Review
12-Apr-2012(#12)
HEY JEYWALKER

Somebody is being mean to a black person! Hurry up! He needs you to defend his honor!
metsfan718
Silver Good Trader
12-Apr-2012(#13)
My interest on my bank account dipped like a mofo right after..

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ShishioMakoto
GameTZ Gold Subscriber Triple Gold Good Trader
Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
12-Apr-2012(#14)
 * poker face *


It's finally time for me to go outside, walk to the nearest tree line, and blow my fudging head off.



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TheDoctor
GameTZ Gold Subscriber 1000 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader
12-Apr-2012(#15)
I can't wait for the debates. It will look like this:


Mitt: Mr President, you are doing everything wrong. I'm pro business and pro middle class. You are a socialist and blah blah blah.
Obama: Tell us about "cheesy grits" Mitt.

DEBATE OVER


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DaveSGE

(abuse)
12-Apr-2012(#16)
thegreatest wrote:
> DaveSGE wrote:
>> thegreatest wrote:
> |>> He may not control it, but who gets blamed for a stock market
> crash?
> |>> The president and his administration.
> |>>
> |>> Except for some reason people seem to forget that Bush was in
> office
> |>> when it crashed and it has done nothing but go up with Obama in
>> office.
> |>>
> |>> image>>" class="wirc" height="140"> >>" title="See this image fullsize">[full]
> |>>
> |>>
>>
>> Because we all know that 9/11 did nothing but positive things for
>> the stock market.
>
> A terrorist attack has no effect on the economy. Wars and banks selling
> loans to corporations while loaning too much money does.
>
> People want Obama impeached because A) They don't want a black president
> for some reason or B) He isn't fixing what Bush did fast enough even
> though things are getting better. I'd like to see someone get anything
> done with congress having a majority from a conflicting party. Give
> the man a chance and see what he can get done.


Lmao, are you being serious? A terrorist attack on home soil has no effect on the economy?

It shut down thousands of businesses, airports, airplanes, imports, exports, and the list goes on. It absolutely had an effect on the economy unlike anything else before it, pretty much. Is quite obvious you know very little about this subject and you should probably read up on it.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economic_effects_aris...

And Clinton ignoring issues entirely is what caused the initial roller coaster decline, not Bush. Had 9/11 never happened, there is a strong possibility that he would have had a favorable run entirely...and that is without mentioning the negative effects that Hurricane Katrina had as well during his tenure.

Since Obama took office, the majority of things have gotten plenty worse and he's made decisions that would have resulted in impeachment otherwise.

I'm not Republican or Democratic, I couldnt care less about sides...
metsfan718
Silver Good Trader
12-Apr-2012(#17)
Great points Dave  * yes *.

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MikeyWhoa
Double Gold Good Trader
12-Apr-2012(#18)
DaveSGE wrote:
> Since Obama took office, the majority of things have gotten plenty
> worse and he's made decisions that would have resulted in impeachment
> otherwise.

Examples, please. I love making you dig up info/stats.




Currently enjoying...
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Josh
Double Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
12-Apr-2012(#19)
SirConnery wrote:
> I can't wait for the debates. It will look like this:
>
>
> Mitt: Mr President, you are doing everything wrong. I'm pro business
> and pro middle class. You are a socialist and blah blah blah.
> Obama: Tell us about "cheesy grits" Mitt.
>
> DEBATE OVER
>
>

I almost spit orange juice all over my screen. Nice one  * yes *
thegreatest
Gold Good Trader Has Written 1 Review
* 12-Apr-2012(#20)
DaveSGE wrote:
> thegreatest wrote:
>> DaveSGE wrote:
> |>> thegreatest wrote:
>> |>> He may not control it, but who gets blamed for a stock market
>> crash?
>> |>> The president and his administration.
>> |>>
>> |>> Except for some reason people seem to forget that Bush was
> in
>> office
>> |>> when it crashed and it has done nothing but go up with Obama
> in
> |>> office.
>> |>>
>> |>> image>" class="wirc" height="140"> >" title="See this image fullsize">[full]
>> |>>
>> |>>
> |>>
> |>> Because we all know that 9/11 did nothing but positive things
> for
> |>> the stock market.
>>
>> A terrorist attack has no effect on the economy. Wars and banks
> selling
>> loans to corporations while loaning too much money does.
>>
>> People want Obama impeached because A) They don't want a black
> president
>> for some reason or B) He isn't fixing what Bush did fast enough
> even
>> though things are getting better. I'd like to see someone get anything
>> done with congress having a majority from a conflicting party.
> Give
>> the man a chance and see what he can get done.
>
>
> Lmao, are you being serious? A terrorist attack on home soil has no
> effect on the economy?
>
> It shut down thousands of businesses, airports, airplanes, imports,
> exports, and the list goes on. It absolutely had an effect on the
> economy unlike anything else before it, pretty much. Is quite obvious
> you know very little about this subject and you should probably read
> up on it.
>
>
> And Clinton ignoring issues entirely is what caused the initial roller
> coaster decline, not Bush. Had 9/11 never happened, there is a strong
> possibility that he would have had a favorable run entirely...and
> that is without mentioning the negative effects that Hurricane Katrina
> had as well during his tenure.
>
> Since Obama took office, the majority of things have gotten plenty
> worse and he's made decisions that would have resulted in impeachment
> otherwise.
>
> I'm not Republican or Democratic, I couldnt care less about sides...

Haha wikipedia articles know a lot about political issues don't they. Where was the stock market at when Clinton was in office? How about gas prices or the economy as a whole?

Also, 9/11 didn't shut anything down. People still flew. People still went to work. What killed the economy was the government turning a blind eye to banks giving out large loans people couldn't afford because corporations and investment firms told them too.

Give me a list of things that are worse now than when Bush was in office. There isn't much. I'd be willing to bet 95% of things have gotten better. Maybe not much better but that is due to republicans controlling congress. He can't get anything passed.
DaveSGE

(abuse)
12-Apr-2012(#21)
thegreatest wrote:
> DaveSGE wrote:
>> thegreatest wrote:
> |>> DaveSGE wrote:
>> |>> thegreatest wrote:
> |>> |>> He may not control it, but who gets blamed for a stock market
> |>> crash?
> |>> |>> The president and his administration.
> |>> |>>
> |>> |>> Except for some reason people seem to forget that Bush was
>> in
> |>> office
> |>> |>> when it crashed and it has done nothing but go up with Obama
>> in
>> |>> office.
> |>> |>>
> |>> |>> image>>" class="wirc" height="140"> >>" title="See this image fullsize">[full]
> |>> |>>
> |>> |>>
>> |>>
>> |>> Because we all know that 9/11 did nothing but positive things
>> for
>> |>> the stock market.
> |>>
> |>> A terrorist attack has no effect on the economy. Wars and banks
>> selling
> |>> loans to corporations while loaning too much money does.
> |>>
> |>> People want Obama impeached because A) They don't want a black
>> president
> |>> for some reason or B) He isn't fixing what Bush did fast enough
>> even
> |>> though things are getting better. I'd like to see someone get
> anything
> |>> done with congress having a majority from a conflicting party.
>> Give
> |>> the man a chance and see what he can get done.
>>
>>
>> Lmao, are you being serious? A terrorist attack on home soil has
> no
>> effect on the economy?
>>
>> It shut down thousands of businesses, airports, airplanes, imports,
>> exports, and the list goes on. It absolutely had an effect on the
>> economy unlike anything else before it, pretty much. Is quite obvious
>> you know very little about this subject and you should probably
> read
>> up on it.
>>
>>
>> And Clinton ignoring issues entirely is what caused the initial
> roller
>> coaster decline, not Bush. Had 9/11 never happened, there is a
> strong
>> possibility that he would have had a favorable run entirely...and
>> that is without mentioning the negative effects that Hurricane
> Katrina
>> had as well during his tenure.
>>
>> Since Obama took office, the majority of things have gotten plenty
>> worse and he's made decisions that would have resulted in impeachment
>> otherwise.
>>
>> I'm not Republican or Democratic, I couldnt care less about sides...
>
> Haha wikipedia articles know a lot about political issues don't they.
> Where was the stock market at when Clinton was in office? How about
> gas prices or the economy as a whole?
>
> Also, 9/11 didn't shut anything down. People still flew. People still
> went to work. What killed the economy was the government turning a
> blind eye to banks giving out large loans people couldn't afford because
> corporations and investment firms told them too.
>
> Give me a list of things that are worse now than when Bush was in
> office. There isn't much. I'd be willing to bet 95% of things have
> gotten better. Maybe not much better but that is due to republicans
> controlling congress. He can't get anything passed.


You're Jeywalker 2.0, I'm not going to waste my time with your ignorance.
MikeyWhoa
Double Gold Good Trader
12-Apr-2012(#22)
C'mon Dave, since when did you care about how stupid you sound?




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metsfan718
Silver Good Trader
12-Apr-2012(#23)
It's not that hard to comprehend Mike. It simply had impacts. Business just in lower Manhattan alone took a huge hit. Then it lead to a whole bunch of other stuff like war. War cost a ton of money alone. Impacts started to happen the second it happened. Lower Manhattan was even a ghost town for a while.
metsfan718
Silver Good Trader
12-Apr-2012(#24)
Also in the towers there were a bunch of things and people that were important to our economy. The sercret service was even there. My mother was a secretary in the 70's-80's for them. She is actually under oath.

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DaveSGE

(abuse)
12-Apr-2012(#25)
They're both clowns, don't bother. It doesnt matter that every major stock exchange closed for roughly a week around the entire world....that didnt effect the economy at all.
MikeyWhoa
Double Gold Good Trader
12-Apr-2012(#26)
metsfan718 wrote:
> It's not that hard to comprehend Mike. It simply had impacts. Business
> just in lower Manhattan alone took a huge hit. Then it lead to a whole
> bunch of other stuff like war. War cost a ton of money alone. Impacts
> started to happen the second it happened. Lower Manhattan was even
> a ghost town for a while.

I'm not talking about 911. I'm fully aware business, and the market took a hit after the attacks. I'm not even sure why your dragging me into that argument. I agree with you both. That however was 7 years before Obama took office. I even quoted the part of Dave's retort I was referencing. I wanted him to give me the reasons why he thinks Obama is doing so horrible. Read more carefully next time before assuming I'm saying something that I'm not.




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thegreatest
Gold Good Trader Has Written 1 Review
12-Apr-2012(#27)
9/11 effected the economy because of the scare tactics used by our government. Little shops closing in Manhattan doesn't lead to a recession. Horrible policies and bad judgement by Bush, Congress, and banks leads to a recession.

And like Mike said, please give us some sort of evidence on how Obama has hurt the economy. He hasn't.
Middleton94
Bronze Good Trader
12-Apr-2012(#28)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/US_conflicts

^List of American conflicts and operations. How many times has congress declared war? 5 How many times have they approved engagements? 12

"On at least 125 such occasions, the President acted without prior express authorization from Congress." <--http://www.justice.gov/olc/warpowers925.htm
Josh
Double Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
13-Apr-2012(#29)
metsfan718 wrote:
> It's not that hard to comprehend Mike. It simply had impacts. Business
> just in lower Manhattan alone took a huge hit. Then it lead to a whole
> bunch of other stuff like war. War cost a ton of money alone. Impacts
> started to happen the second it happened. Lower Manhattan was even
> a ghost town for a while.

Also don't forget that war....war never changes.
Scorch
Deal with it. GameTZ Subscriber Triple Gold Good Trader
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This user is on the site NOW (10 minutes ago)
13-Apr-2012(#30)
If president Bush and that administration didn't get in trouble for the war in Iraq I'm not gonna go after Obama for that crap about helping freakin syria or whatever. that was more uncalled for than this.

_
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dracula
Has Written 7 Reviews
(abandoned)
* 13-Apr-2012(#31)
thegreatest wrote:
> Give me a list of things that are worse now than when Bush was in
> office.


Unemployment is up. It is over 8%. Higher than it has been since Jimmy Carter was president. http://data.bls.gov/pdq/SurveyOutputServlet?reques...
Obama signed the NDAA on new years eve 2011, making it legal to arrest citizens without a warrant.
The national debt is up to 16 TRILLION. It was 10 Trillion when obama took office in january of 2009.
In an attempt to dilute the debt, we have increased the money supply by printing up money. The Fed has lowered the interest rate to create more inflation. The price of commodities in USA dollars is forced up.

So we have more debt, fewer jobs, less freedom, and a dollar is worth a lot less than it was 4 years ago, effectively making all of us poorer.

The Obama jobs bill did nothing to create jobs, but instead gave money to special interest groups like solyndra

We also have Obamacare, could be a talking point for the 2012 election- Ironically, the blueprint for obamacare came from romneycare in Massachusetts. Over the summer, the supreme court will decide whether or not obamacare is constitutional. One sticking point: people that don't want, or need health care coverage(for example, healthy people age 18 to 25) are forced to pay a mandatory tax penalty under obamacare. The bill was rushed through congress, justices roberts and kennedy are apparently the swing votes that will decide obamacare's fate..



There isn't much. I'd be willing to bet 95% of things have
> gotten better.


Most of the Obama supporters have given up trying to say we are better off now than 4 years ago, but instead say that we should vote for Obama because he is better than the alternative. Even now, you cant come up with one thing that is better now compared to 4 years ago. I guess you could say that things are better in the middle east? Osama is dead, but we still have over 1000000 troops in Afghanistan, and we have shifted our troops from Iraq to Afghanistan. Under Obama, we are spending over 700 billion on the military, the most bush ever spent was 585 Billion.(china has the next biggest military budget at 7 billion....)

If you want to say that we are 95% better now, you would have to ignore the economy, the military, our civil liberty and our debt. Those have all got much worse.
dracula
Has Written 7 Reviews
(abandoned)
13-Apr-2012(#32)
Scorch wrote:
> If president Bush and that administration didn't get in trouble for
> the war in Iraq I'm not gonna go after Obama for that crap about helping
> freakin syria or whatever. that was more uncalled for than this.


Bush went to congress with bad information saying that Iraq had nuclear weapons, we were in danger etc. Congress voted for that war.

The current impeachment on Obama is more likely preemptive to block Obama from further creating conflict with syria and Iran without going to congress for a vote.

If we are going to have a constitution and create laws saying we wont go to war without getting a vote from congress, we probably should abide by the constitution, (whether it is bush, obama, clinton, etc). Or are you saying since one president ignored the constitution, then that makes it OK for Obama to ignore the constitution? I won't ever agree with that, I am guessing congress won't either.
DaveSGE

(abuse)
13-Apr-2012(#33)
thegreatest wrote:
> 9/11 effected the economy because of the scare tactics used by our
> government. Little shops closing in Manhattan doesn't lead to a recession.
> Horrible policies and bad judgement by Bush, Congress, and banks leads
> to a recession.

Still can't get over how stupid this comment is.

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Scorch
Deal with it. GameTZ Subscriber Triple Gold Good Trader
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* 13-Apr-2012(#34)
dracula wrote:
> Scorch wrote:
>> If president Bush and that administration didn't get in trouble
> for
>> the war in Iraq I'm not gonna go after Obama for that crap about
> helping
>> freakin syria or whatever. that was more uncalled for than this.
>
>
> Bush went to congress with bad information saying that Iraq had nuclear
> weapons, we were in danger etc. Congress voted for that war.
>
> The current impeachment on Obama is more likely preemptive to block
> Obama from further creating conflict with syria and Iran without going
> to congress for a vote.
>
> If we are going to have a constitution and create laws saying we wont
> go to war without getting a vote from congress, we probably should
> abide by the constitution, (whether it is bush, obama, clinton, etc).
> Or are you saying since one president ignored the constitution, then
> that makes it OK for Obama to ignore the constitution? I won't ever
> agree with that, I am guessing congress won't either.

Yeah, I'm just saying it was stupid of him to not go to congress but I personally don't care enough about president Obama's action enough to think he should be impeached. basically we went to Iraq for "WMD reasons", to use a term David Stern might use, that I saw as much worse than what president Obama did in Syria. Despite how dumb that may be  * raspberry *
There's some kinda Ghandi quote about "just because a law exists does not mean it is just" or something to that extent. I dno't know how I as going to wrok that into my explanation but there it is and is has something to do with what I was going to say. I understand the basis for why people are promoting his impeachment but idk if president Bush used bullcrap to send us to Iraq I see that as being worse so why bother impeaching Obama.
TL:DR - I'm drunk and yes you're completely right, because he didn't go through the proper channels, but idk I just think what Obama did isn't a big deal.
and PS how did this happen then? wouldn't they not send troops until Congress approved anyways?
_
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dracula
Has Written 7 Reviews
(abandoned)
* 13-Apr-2012(#35)
Scorch wrote:
> TL:DR - I'm drunk and yes you're completely right, because he didn't
> go through the proper channels, but idk I just think what Obama did
> isn't a big deal.
> and PS how did this happen then? wouldn't they not send troops until
> Congress approved anyways?


Obama got approval from the United Nations and they went ahead and got involved in Lybia, it happened fast.

It's a bad precedent, doing the same thing in Syria and/or Iran would be a bigger deal.

Ironically, the fed had been giving money to lybian central banks http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ll6M5OnooVc


edit, I might as well mention how clinton happened to get in trouble for bombing serbia. Milosevic had undergone an ethnic cleansing campaign against the Kurds. During a holocaust, against a mad dictator, all bets are off. Clinton got involved in an extended conflict without going to congress first and got sued. Ultimately, it was probably the right thing to do. Gaddafi was another insane dictator, the UN wanted to help get him out of power, Obama wanted to help. And yes, we were in the process of giving the bank of Libya money to bail them out at the time.
masterchief06
Tell me what you cherish most. Give me the pleasure of taking it away. GameTZ Subscriber 250 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader
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13-Apr-2012(#36)
thegreatest wrote:
> psx_4 wrote:
>> That's not the issue.
>
> What exactly is the issue then? Last I checked the DOW is higher than
> it has been since like 06 or something.

If you think the DOW being the highest its been since '06 is ANY indicator of financial fortitude or Obama's impact in this country, then you obviously have very little understanding of the stock market.


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TheDoctor
GameTZ Gold Subscriber 1000 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader
13-Apr-2012(#37)
Regardless of what's going on, the election is going to come down to a popularity contest.

Mitt Romney
-- Rich
-- Old
-- White
-- Pro Business
-- Has problems conversing with common folks with no slip-ups. Expect photo ops with average joe orchestrated by the GOP.
-- Lack of charisma


Obama
-- Not wealthy, but not poor either.
-- Old unless he dies his hair, then he can shed about 10 years off his appearance.
-- Black
-- Good debater.
-- Probably sort of rusty at debating.
-- Has charisma.
-- Can speak efficiently with common folks.


The GOP seriously needs to get rid of that rich old white guy bit. If they add a woman to the mix, she should be intelligent and not a redneck. Yes I'm talking about the Sarah Palin fail. Latino is the new Black so they should really have a Latino VP. Problem there is whoever he/she is, they would outshine Romney.

Romney isn't a bad guy. In fact I see him as a Democrat. He's just batting for the opposing team because it benefits him financially and furthers his business ties. I don't think he believes half of what he spouts on behalf of the GOP.
dracula
Has Written 7 Reviews
(abandoned)
13-Apr-2012(#38)
masterchief06 wrote:
> thegreatest wrote:
>> psx_4 wrote:
> |>> That's not the issue.
>>
>> What exactly is the issue then? Last I checked the DOW is higher
> than it has been since like 06 or something.
>
> If you think the DOW being the highest its been since '06 is ANY indicator
> of financial fortitude or Obama's impact in this country, then you
> obviously have very little understanding of the stock market.


High unemployment (over 8%), low economic growth (1.2%), $16 Trillion of debt(Obama is *only* responsible for $6Trillion of it) and high inflation are all markers of bad economic times. Lags are built into the system and it is very likely that the bubble already burst.
DaveSGE

(abuse)
13-Apr-2012(#39)
SirConnery wrote:
> Regardless of what's going on, the election is going to come down
> to a popularity contest.
>
> Mitt Romney
> -- Rich
> -- Old
> -- White
> -- Pro Business
> -- Has problems conversing with common folks with no slip-ups. Expect
> photo ops with average joe orchestrated by the GOP.
> -- Lack of charisma
>
>
> Obama
> -- Not wealthy, but not poor either.
> -- Old unless he dies his hair, then he can shed about 10 years off
> his appearance.
> -- Black
> -- Good debater.
> -- Probably sort of rusty at debating.
> -- Has charisma.
> -- Can speak efficiently with common folks.
>
>
> The GOP seriously needs to get rid of that rich old white guy bit.
> If they add a woman to the mix, she should be intelligent and not
> a redneck. Yes I'm talking about the Sarah Palin fail. Latino is the
> new Black so they should really have a Latino VP. Problem there is
> whoever he/she is, they would outshine Romney.
>
> Romney isn't a bad guy. In fact I see him as a Democrat. He's just
> batting for the opposing team because it benefits him financially
> and furthers his business ties. I don't think he believes half of
> what he spouts on behalf of the GOP.


Obama definitely has the speech advantage and to be honest, I think that is a huge advantage...being a great orator can be the difference between losing and winning...
dracula
Has Written 7 Reviews
(abandoned)
* 13-Apr-2012(#40)
SirConnery wrote:
> Regardless of what's going on, the election is going to come down
> to a popularity contest.
>


Hasn't that always been the case? And I actually agree that obama and romney are very similar candidates: they have the same health care policy, the same foreign agenda, and have no problem increasing the debt.

I am hoping ron paul runs as a third party candidate. he will take votes from both Obama and Romney. Paul is the only one that wants to bring the troops home, pay off the national debt and stop the hyperinflation.

I dont expect people to support RP, but he brings up some good points that the other candidates are ignoring, and this clip is worth listening to.


As for Obama being a good speaker, funny because I never thought he gave good speeches and has tremendous difficulty answering questions. He gave one good speech, at the 2004 Democratic National Convention. He never really does that well at debates however.
dracula
Has Written 7 Reviews
(abandoned)
* 13-Apr-2012(#41)
Outinthedark wrote:
> You're a month behind. >">Already seen and talked about this before. Clinton was also
> impeached. Impeach means nothing more than to accuse. Congress is
> just mad Obama listened to the UN's declaration rather than them.


That's just it, on one hand, congress may be sick of Obama walking all over them and ignoring the constitution. But the question is whether the a democrat controlled senate would put one of their own on trial *and* find him guilty.

Obama said he would unify us, he probably didnt intend for us to unify ourselves against him. To give you some idea just how out of touch Obama is with the economy, a couple weeks ago, his budget proposal went to the house and was unanimously voted down 0 to 414 http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?story...
metsfan718
Silver Good Trader
13-Apr-2012(#42)
thegreatest wrote:
> 9/11 effected the economy because of the scare tactics used
> by our government. Little shops closing in Manhattan doesn't
> lead to a recession. Horrible policies and bad judgement
> by Bush, Congress, and banks leads to a recession.
>
> And like Mike said, please give us some sort of evidence
> on how Obama has hurt the economy. He hasn't.

Well I know shops closing was not a huge cause of our economy issues.But on the other hand just lower Manhattan in general was a huge center for our economy. Corporations had their headquarters there for example.All of what happened just discourages companys from expanding. Politics aside there was no way this could of been prevented. We totally had no idea.
Doesn't matter which political party had reign. Unless you believe in conspiracy theories...
Karaiya
Gold Good Trader Has Written 1 Review
13-Apr-2012(#43)
Let's get rid of this black guy in the white house.

This new interface has me confused  * wry smile *

image
Scott
It's a secret to everybody. GameTZ Subscriber Triple Gold Good Trader
Global Trader - willing to trade internationally Has Written 1 Review
13-Apr-2012(#44)
Obama and Romney are basically the same to me. They're both going to keep spending money we don't have, do nothing about our debt, keep fighting wars, etc.

We need some real change:

image
flyngmonbob
GameTZ Gold Subscriber Double Gold Good Trader
13-Apr-2012(#45)
Karaiya wrote:
> Let's get rid of this black guy in the white house.
>
> This new interface has me confused  * wry smile *

I'm honestly waiting for one of the white candidates to slip up and actually say that its all the black guys fault
dracula
Has Written 7 Reviews
(abandoned)
13-Apr-2012(#46)
Scott wrote:
> Obama and Romney are basically the same to me. They're both going
> to keep spending money we don't have, do nothing about our debt, keep
> fighting wars, etc.
>
> We need some real change:
>


I am not that optimistic for 2012. The good news is that people are waking up to the reality that carrying a 16 Trillion dollar debt is a bad idea, especially the younger people(who will get stuck footing the bill).
Concat
Bronze Good Trader Canada
13-Apr-2012(#47)
I have a feeling that there will be an impeachment movement for every future president from now on. There's this mentality that if you don't agree with an administration's policies, it's not a difference of opinion, it's a clear indication that the president is unfit. Hell there are probably people that want Obama impeached because "he's a Muslim."

It's pretty incredible how politics in the States revolve around such non-issues for so many voters. No one gives a crap about foreign policies or the national debt. They care about the man, and if he's a white, Christian, married dude. And even when a black man wins, they celebrate not because of this character, but because he's black. It's just a big theatre.

dracula
Has Written 7 Reviews
(abandoned)
13-Apr-2012(#48)
Concat wrote:
> I have a feeling that there will be an impeachment movement for every
> future president from now on. There's this mentality that if you
> don't agree with an administration's policies, it's not a difference
> of opinion, it's a clear indication that the president is unfit.
> Hell there are probably people that want Obama impeached because "he's
> a Muslim."
>
> It's pretty incredible how politics in the States revolve around such
> non-issues for so many voters. No one gives a crap about foreign
> policies or the national debt. They care about the man, and if he's
> a white, Christian, married dude. And even when a black man wins,
> they celebrate not because of this character, but because he's black.
> It's just a big theatre.
|


Just checking, are you saying that the president(whether it is Obama or someone else) should be able to send troops to Libya, Syria, and Iran without getting a vote from Congress and he shouldnt be getting impeached?

Lino
I am YOU are me GameTZ Subscriber Silver Good Trader
Has Written 2 Reviews
13-Apr-2012(#49)
You guys are all fudging retarded, seriously.

Such short, short memories.


First off, 9/11 has nothing to do with the economy. If anything, the Bush administration was using the age-old strategy that war improves the economy, but what was true in 1942 is not necessarily true today. Everyone with half a brain knew that an invasion into Iraq and Afghanistan would cripple our economy.

Just like everyone with half a brain could see what was going to happen --


1. Obama inherits a crap storm from the previous guy
2. Is asked to fix it
3. Everyone forgets who made the mess
4. Then blames Obama for the mess


This is why the liberals promote education so passionately. You guys forget this crap so quickly.

Add to the fact that the right-wing have ADMITTED to being obstructionists to the president's plans, wishing that the country was in ruin just so that they can blame Obama...


 * poker face *
Lino
I am YOU are me GameTZ Subscriber Silver Good Trader
Has Written 2 Reviews
13-Apr-2012(#50)
And you guys know Alex Jones, the creator of the video and channel, believes that the people in power, our politicians, etc., believe in serving an alien master race? Literally, they are working for the alien beings.....



 * poker face *
Renaissance2K
Silver Good Trader Has Written 4 Reviews
13-Apr-2012(#51)
Screw you guys. I'm voting for President Camacho.
Lino
I am YOU are me GameTZ Subscriber Silver Good Trader
Has Written 2 Reviews
13-Apr-2012(#52)
I like Obama but...

He made two huge mistakes during his presidency that he should be impeached for:


1. Staffing his cabinet with all of the wall street bankers and thugs that helped put our economy in the mess it is in

2. Removing the cap from campaign financing allowing a single individual or corporation the right to finance a politician with infinite contributions, without transparency



 * poker face *
metsfan718
Silver Good Trader
13-Apr-2012(#53)
MikeyWhoa wrote:
> metsfan718 wrote:
>> It's not that hard to comprehend Mike. It simply had
> impacts. Business
>> just in lower Manhattan alone took a huge hit. Then it
> lead to a whole
>> bunch of other stuff like war. War cost a ton of money
> alone. Impacts
>> started to happen the second it happened. Lower Manhattan
> was even
>> a ghost town for a while.
>
> I'm not talking about 911. I'm fully aware business, and
> the market took a hit after the attacks. I'm not even sure
> why your dragging me into that argument. I agree with you
> both. That however was 7 years before Obama took office.
> I even quoted the part of Dave's retort I was referencing.
> I wanted him to give me the reasons why he thinks Obama
> is doing so horrible. Read more carefully next time before
> assuming I'm saying something that I'm not.
>
>
>
Well you said you wanted examples. People usually want examples
When they disagree.

GTZ E Cig forum:
http://gametz.com/forum/USER%3A101978

flyngmonbob
GameTZ Gold Subscriber Double Gold Good Trader
13-Apr-2012(#54)
Lino wrote:
> And you guys know Alex Jones, the creator of the video and channel,
> believes that the people in power, our politicians, etc., believe
> in serving an alien master race? Literally, they are working for the
> alien beings.....

People believe in god too, you can't honestly say that that is more realistic than aliens.
Reed
400 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
13-Apr-2012(#55)
I will transmit this information to Vladimir.
DaveSGE

(abuse)
13-Apr-2012(#56)
Lino wrote:
> You guys are all fudging retarded, seriously.
>
> Such short, short memories.
>
>
> First off, 9/11 has nothing to do with the economy. If anything, the
> Bush administration was using the age-old strategy that war improves
> the economy, but what was true in 1942 is not necessarily true today.
> Everyone with half a brain knew that an invasion into Iraq and Afghanistan
> would cripple our economy.
>
> Just like everyone with half a brain could see what was going to happen
> --
>
>
> 1. Obama inherits a crap storm from the previous guy
> 2. Is asked to fix it
> 3. Everyone forgets who made the mess
> 4. Then blames Obama for the mess
>
>
> This is why the liberals promote education so passionately. You guys
> forget this crap so quickly.
>
> Add to the fact that the right-wing have ADMITTED to being
> obstructionists to the president's plans, wishing that the country
> was in ruin just so that they can blame Obama...
>
>
>

Lol

image
Lino
I am YOU are me GameTZ Subscriber Silver Good Trader
Has Written 2 Reviews
13-Apr-2012(#57)
flyngmonbob wrote:
> Lino wrote:
>> And you guys know Alex Jones, the creator of the video and channel,
>> believes that the people in power, our politicians, etc., believe
>> in serving an alien master race? Literally, they are working for
> the
>> alien beings.....
>
> People believe in god too, you can't honestly say that that is more
> realistic than aliens.

Hey, I believe in aliens and am actually a big Alex Jones fan.

I'm just saying be careful what you listen to with absolution, there's a lot of crap out there. I listen to his show every day, literally every morning as I get dressed for work. It isn't really Obama that Alex Jones dislikes, it's the veil beneath, the guys pulling the strings. You can clearly see a pattern and similarities between Obama and Bush.


I mean, is it really fair to criticize Obama for trying to add more absolute powers for the commander in chief when George Bush opened that door a long time ago with a lot more unprecedented power trips with the Patriot Act, etc. Ask yourself, "was I complaining when Bush did it?"


 * poker face *
Lino
I am YOU are me GameTZ Subscriber Silver Good Trader
Has Written 2 Reviews
13-Apr-2012(#58)
DaveSGE wrote:
> Lino wrote:
>> You guys are all fudging retarded, seriously.
>>
>> Such short, short memories.
>>
>>
>> First off, 9/11 has nothing to do with the economy. If anything,
> the
>> Bush administration was using the age-old strategy that war improves
>> the economy, but what was true in 1942 is not necessarily true
> today.
>> Everyone with half a brain knew that an invasion into Iraq and
> Afghanistan
>> would cripple our economy.
>>
>> Just like everyone with half a brain could see what was going to
> happen
>> --
>>
>>
>> 1. Obama inherits a crap storm from the previous guy
>> 2. Is asked to fix it
>> 3. Everyone forgets who made the mess
>> 4. Then blames Obama for the mess
>>
>>
>> This is why the liberals promote education so passionately. You
> guys
>> forget this crap so quickly.
>>
>> Add to the fact that the right-wing have ADMITTED to being
>> obstructionists to the president's plans, wishing that the country
>> was in ruin just so that they can blame Obama...
>>
>>
>>
>
> Lol
>
>

My same sentiments reading your stuff..... again, very short memory you have


 * poker face *
Lino
I am YOU are me GameTZ Subscriber Silver Good Trader
Has Written 2 Reviews
13-Apr-2012(#60)
When we say "the economy was effected" I'm assuming that we're all talking about the nation's economy, not the city of NY.

Obviously, there's a little windfall from a huge disaster. And of course, markets were effected, investors were afraid and more conservative, but those were only initial and immediate responses to the tragedy. Nothing was really affected permanently.



 * poker face *
metsfan718
Silver Good Trader
13-Apr-2012(#61)
Nope nationally. The airline system for our entire country was hurt. Then that lead to to people not wanting to travel anywhere.

GTZ E Cig forum:
http://gametz.com/forum/USER%3A101978

masterchief06
Tell me what you cherish most. Give me the pleasure of taking it away. GameTZ Subscriber 250 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader
Has Written 1 Review
* 13-Apr-2012(#62)
Lino wrote:
> You guys are all fudging retarded, seriously.
>
> Such short, short memories.
>
>
> First off, 9/11 has nothing to do with the economy. If anything, the
> Bush administration was using the age-old strategy that war improves
> the economy, but what was true in 1942 is not necessarily true today.
> Everyone with half a brain knew that an invasion into Iraq and Afghanistan
> would cripple our economy.
>
> Just like everyone with half a brain could see what was going to happen
> --
>
>
> 1. Obama inherits a crap storm from the previous guy
> 2. Is asked to fix it
> 3. Everyone forgets who made the mess
> 4. Then blames Obama for the mess
>
>
> This is why the liberals promote education so passionately. You guys
> forget this crap so quickly.
>
> Add to the fact that the right-wing have ADMITTED to being
> obstructionists to the president's plans, wishing that the country
> was in ruin just so that they can blame Obama...
>
>
>
Obama may have inherited a country in shambles, but has he done anything to fix it? No. He had a supermajority in the House and the Senate for two years and all he could get passed was healthcare and the bailouts of banks and auto companies in the US. Don't give me this crap about how Republican's are obstructionists. They vote NO when Obama is pursuing his far left agenda that everyone knows is terrible for the fabric of America. I think YOU have a selective memory, because when the bill passed the House of Representatives, the vote was 219-212. Yes, all the Republicans vote NO, but so did 34 "obstructionist" Democrats by your definition. I think the most amusing part of Obamacare is Nancy Pelosi's idea that we had, "to pass the law to find out what's in it." This is the dangerous kind of thought that comes out of liberals too apathetic/ignorant of the executive/legislative/judicial systems to know how to operate in office. The hilarity is now Obama is challenging the Supreme Court publicly (unprecedented move probably aimed to sway the ruling) because of the "bipartisan" passage of Obamacare. The only thing "bipartisan" about Obamacare is the opposition. Presidents ALWAYS keep their mouth shut regarding a case that is currently being examined in the Supreme Court to prevent any bias one way or another, and Obama can't even do that. The federal judge that required Holder to provide a 3 page, single spaced explanation of the Obama Administration's understanding of the importance of judicial review should've awoken some of the lefties, but I'm sure it didn't.

So, Obama has two years to ram whatever he wants down the throats of Americans and can only get two radical pieces of legislation passed. Here's an article I'd recommend reading (from NPR, for those who want to claim bias of the article). Of course Bush spent like a liberal. Of course conservatives berated him about it. But for all of the deficit increase that Bush did in his EIGHT years, "During Obama's presidency to date, the national debt has risen by an average of $1.723 trillion a year — or by a jaw-dropping $1.116 trillion more, per year, than it rose even under Bush." The article then says:

"How do Bush and Obama compare on closer inspection? Just about like they do on an initial glance. According to the White House's Office of Management and Budget, during his eight fiscal years, Bush ran up a total of $3.283 trillion in deficit spending (p. 22). In his first two fiscal years, Obama will run up a total of $2.826 trillion in deficit spending ($1.294 trillion in 2010, an estimated $1.267 trillion in 2011 (p. 23), and the $265 billion in "stimulus" money that was spent in 2009). Thus, Bush ran up an average of $410 billion in deficit spending per year, while Obama is running up an average of $1.413 trillion in deficit spending per year — or $1.003 trillion a year more than Bush."

Perfect illustration here. I DO blame Obama for the mess that we are currently in because he has followed through on ZERO of his campaign promises thus far. He passed an unconstitutional "healthcare" bill, has racked up national debt faster than any previous President EVER, signed a continuation of both The Patriot Act and Bush Era Tax Cuts, failed to close down Guantanamo Bay, etc etc etc. The guy is obviously unqualified, in way over his head, and has also done the best job of dividing a country down class and racial lines than any President before him.

I applaud any politician who has the nerve to stand up to the liberal machine and challenge what they mindlessly sign into law. If you're an obstructionist to wildly radical legislators and the most radical President in US history, then you're falling on the correct side of the battle. The 2010 election is also a great illustration of the agreement from Americans nationwide that the liberals need to go and that they support the effort to STOP all the ridiculous moves liberals were using to drive these damning pieces of legislation down our throats. Reconciliation is designed for budget legislation, not one that redefines the insurance and healthcare industry entirely. Yet the liberals were shameless in their usage of it in order to side step the BIPARTISAN and SUBSTANTIAL opposition to the bill.

I can't wait until he is out of Office. He could have the charisma of a Hollywood star, but he is ruining this country.


image
image
image

Lino
I am YOU are me GameTZ Subscriber Silver Good Trader
Has Written 2 Reviews
13-Apr-2012(#63)
ok i'll give you that one, there were effects, no doubt about it.

But long-lasting economical effects, no. And not enough to cause the crap that we're in currently, caused by the banking failures and housing bubbles


 * poker face *
Reed
400 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
13-Apr-2012(#64)
Lino wrote:
> caused by the banking failures and housing
> bubbles

which were caused by big government, which Obama made even bigger, bro.
ShishioMakoto
GameTZ Gold Subscriber Triple Gold Good Trader
Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
* 13-Apr-2012(#65)
masterchief06 wrote:

tl;dr


image
masterchief06
Tell me what you cherish most. Give me the pleasure of taking it away. GameTZ Subscriber 250 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader
Has Written 1 Review
13-Apr-2012(#66)
ShishioMakoto wrote:
> masterchief06 wrote:
>
> tl;dr
>
>
>
And you're part of the ignorant/apathetic problem.


image
image
image

MikeyWhoa
Double Gold Good Trader
13-Apr-2012(#67)
First off, thank you for making an educated list, instead of just name calling and bailing.

dracula wrote:
>
>
> Unemployment is up. It is over 8%. Higher than it has been since
> Obama signed the NDAA on new years eve 2011, making it legal to arrest
> citizens without a warrant.
> The national debt is up to 16 TRILLION. It was 10 Trillion when obama
> took office in january of 2009.
> In an attempt to dilute the debt, we have increased the money supply
> by printing up money. The Fed has lowered the interest rate to create
> more inflation. The price of commodities in USA dollars is forced
> up.
>
> So we have more debt, fewer jobs, less freedom, and a dollar is worth
> a lot less than it was 4 years ago, effectively making all of us poorer.
>
> The Obama jobs bill did nothing to create jobs, but instead gave money
> to special interest groups like >">solyndra

Debt is still skyrocketing up. No debate there.

The recession began just as Bush left and Obama started. Unemployment shot up the moment he took office. If you want to blame Obama for that, then there is nothing I can say. It takes time to clean up a big mess. I don't think anyone could have done better when it comes to unemployment in that time. After the recession, the rate has dropped, albeit very slowly.

Click here to see a chart of of the number of private jobs added since Obama took office. While admittedly yes, it's not ideal, it's certainly not worse.

>
> We also have Obamacare, could be a talking point for the 2012 election-
> Ironically, the blueprint for obamacare came from romneycare in Massachusetts.
> Over the summer, the supreme court will decide whether or not obamacare
> is constitutional. One sticking point: people that don't want, or
> need health care coverage(for example, healthy people age 18 to 25)
> are forced to pay a mandatory tax penalty under obamacare. The bill
> was rushed through congress, justices roberts and kennedy are apparently
> the swing votes that will decide obamacare's fate..
>

While we can debate ideaology, I can't see the problem with having more peoples health covered. This again is not the ideal solution. It is however not worse to have more people covered.

As far as his accomplishments go...

Killed Osama

Helped save the American Auto Industry (I'm no fan of bailouts, but results are results)

Repealed "Don't Ask, Don't Tell"

Instituted enforcement for equal pay for women

Fully funded the Violence Against Women Act

Established a credit card "Bill Of Rights"

Reversed restrictions on stem cell research

Ended War in Iraq

Raised fuel economy standards

Invest in alternative energy (Stopped ignoring Climate Change)

Families of fallen soldiers have expenses covered to be on hand when the body arrives at Dover AFB

List goes on...

While I'm not %100 on board with Obama, he deserves more credit than people give him. There are definitely places he needs to improve, but given the situation I believe he has been a decent leader. It's got to be hard when the population is accusing you of being a socialist/communist muslim terrorist anti-christ. I have never seen so many negative attacks against a president. Just this past Wednesday, Foster Friess quipped that he hopes Obamas "teleprompters are bulletproof." I feel sorry for him.






Currently enjoying...
image

ShishioMakoto
GameTZ Gold Subscriber Triple Gold Good Trader
Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
13-Apr-2012(#68)
masterchief06 wrote:
> ShishioMakoto wrote:
>> masterchief06 wrote:
>>
>> tl;dr
>>
>>
>>
> And you're part of the ignorant/apathetic problem.
>

No, I could browse quickly and see that you're an ignorant moron. Keep thinking Obama is the problem. Idiot.

image
GlassjawRules13
Double Gold Good Trader
* 13-Apr-2012(#69)
impeach him so who can take over? Biden? Romney? lol... good one, let's see how much gets done then.
ShishioMakoto
GameTZ Gold Subscriber Triple Gold Good Trader
Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
* 13-Apr-2012(#70)
I have an idea:

Let's vote Mitt "Piece of fudging crap-butt-hole" Romney in. I'm sure you're life will be great, and the country's problems which have been created over the last 30 years will be solved.

image
Renaissance2K
Silver Good Trader Has Written 4 Reviews
13-Apr-2012(#71)
Reed wrote:
> Lino wrote:
>> caused by the banking failures and housing
>> bubbles
>
> which were caused by big government, which Obama made even bigger,
> bro.

I was under the impression that the banking failures and housing bubbles were the result of deregulation. If anything, isn't that making the government "smaller"?

Bro?
Lino
I am YOU are me GameTZ Subscriber Silver Good Trader
Has Written 2 Reviews
13-Apr-2012(#72)
masterchief06 wrote:
>
> Obama may have inherited a country in shambles, but has he done anything
> to fix it? No. He had a supermajority in the House and the Senate
> for two years and all he could get passed was healthcare and the bailouts
> of banks and auto companies in the US.

Apparently they needed bailing out...? Seems like an unavoidable choice he was faced with day one.

What was the alternative? To starve the country?


> Don't give me this crap about
> how Republican's are obstructionists. They vote NO when Obama is
> pursuing his far left agenda that everyone knows is terrible for the
> fabric of America. I think YOU have a selective memory, because when
> the bill passed the House of Representatives, the vote was 219-212.
> Yes, all the Republicans vote NO, but so did 34 "obstructionist"
> Democrats by your definition. I think the most amusing part of Obamacare
> is Nancy Pelosi's idea that we had, "to pass the law to find out what's
> in it." This is the dangerous kind of thought that comes out of liberals
> too apathetic/ignorant of the executive/legislative/judicial systems
> to know how to operate in office. The hilarity is now Obama is challenging
> the Supreme Court publicly (unprecedented move probably aimed to
> sway the ruling) because of the "bipartisan" passage of Obamacare.
> The only thing "bipartisan" about Obamacare is the opposition. Presidents
> ALWAYS keep their mouth shut regarding a case that is currently being
> examined in the Supreme Court to prevent any bias one way or another,
> and Obama can't even do that. The federal judge that required Holder
> to provide a 3 page, single spaced explanation of the Obama Administration's
> understanding of the importance of judicial review should've awoken
> some of the lefties, but I'm sure it didn't.
>

I'm not sure where I stand on Obamacare. Afterall, this was something Mitt Romney and other republicans are now getting credit for introducing years ago.

I don't have healthcare myself, and don't need it. I don't like the idea of me being forced to pay for it.


But let's not forget why Obamacare was created and what it attempts to solve -- Those without insurance, like me, are driving up the rates for people like you, who have insurance, when I get sick or hurt and need emergency care. But if I can't pay for it the costs are passed on to you.

Clearly not without it's faults, Obamacare attempts to create a more national-based healthcare that most of the industrialized world has implemented already. It tries to solve the mega holes that current insurance policy has. Things like being dropped from your coverage unfairly, ignoring claims, rejections based on pre-existing conditions, healthcare based on monetary kickbacks like unnecessary prescriptions or procedures, etc.


>
> "How do Bush and Obama compare on closer inspection? Just about like
> they do on an initial glance. According to the White House's Office
> of Management and Budget, during his eight fiscal years, Bush ran
> up a total of $3.283 trillion in deficit spending (p. 22). In his
> first two fiscal years, Obama will run up a total of $2.826 trillion
> in deficit spending ($1.294 trillion in 2010, an estimated $1.267
> trillion in 2011 (p. 23), and the $265 billion in "stimulus" money
> that was spent in 2009). Thus, Bush ran up an average of $410 billion
> in deficit spending per year, while Obama is running up an average
> of $1.413 trillion in deficit spending per year — or $1.003 trillion
> a year more than Bush."
>

He is battling a recession. An improvement in the economy would increase GDP, which would reduce his ratios. The liberal agenda has always been to spend a little more, and he has always said that his strategy would be to basically spend his way out of the recession.

That is what government is supposed to do when the nation, at large, is in a hole. Why? Because it's government debt. It's secured. It's fixable at a future date.


> Perfect illustration here. I DO blame Obama for the mess that we
> are currently in because he has followed through on ZERO of his campaign
> promises thus far. He passed an unconstitutional "healthcare" bill,
> has racked up national debt faster than any previous President EVER,
> signed a continuation of both The Patriot Act and Bush Era Tax Cuts,
> failed to close down Guantanamo Bay, etc etc etc. The guy is obviously
> unqualified, in way over his head, and has also done the best job
> of dividing a country down class and racial lines than any President
> before him.
>

So you were expecting him to not continue Patriot and Bush Tax cuts?

Guantanamo, yeah, he didn't do it in his first 4 years. Maybe his next 4? But regardless, keeping it open seems like something you'd be down for. Where else are we gonna put all the terrorists that are trying to eat your children?


> I applaud any politician who has the nerve to stand up to the liberal
> machine and challenge what they mindlessly sign into law. If you're
> an obstructionist to wildly radical legislators and the most radical
> President in US history, then you're falling on the correct side of
> the battle. The 2010 election is also a great illustration of the
> agreement from Americans nationwide that the liberals need to go and
> that they support the effort to STOP all the ridiculous moves liberals
> were using to drive these damning pieces of legislation down our throats.
> Reconciliation is designed for budget legislation, not one that redefines
> the insurance and healthcare industry entirely, yet the liberals were
> shameless in their usage of it in order to side step the BIPARTISAN
> and SUBSTANTIAL opposition to the bill.

The dem's Senate majority means very little. The republicans can and have blocked all legislation through filibusters. Democrats are not in charge because you need 60 votes to do anything in these bi-partisan times.

All of the power resides in the House's lower chamber, where the Republicans have sole power for tax and spending legislation.

What jobs plan have the Republicans come up with? The R takeover of the house has set up Boehner and Cantor as figureheads to foil the president at every turn he can get.

They have more loyalty to Grover Norquist and the Koch Brothers than the president, the country, the people, etc.


>
> I can't wait until he is out of Office. He could have the charisma
> of a Hollywood star, but he is ruining this country.
>
>

Too harsh. He hasn't done anything worse than the previous president did.



 * poker face *
Lino
I am YOU are me GameTZ Subscriber Silver Good Trader
Has Written 2 Reviews
13-Apr-2012(#73)
Renaissance2K wrote:
> Reed wrote:
>> Lino wrote:
> |>> caused by the banking failures and housing
> |>> bubbles
>>
>> which were caused by big government, which Obama made even bigger,
>> bro.
>
> I was under the impression that the banking failures and housing bubbles
> were the result of deregulation. If anything, isn't that making the
> government "smaller"?
>
> Bro?

If it were up to big business and the right, there'd be no regulation, no oversight on anything.

Let's just trust that the beef industry makes sure they clean down their counter tops when cutting up the next cow. Ah, they probably will.



 * poker face *
Reed
400 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
13-Apr-2012(#74)
Renaissance2K wrote:

> I was under the impression that the banking failures and housing bubbles
> were the result of deregulation. If anything, isn't that making the
> government "smaller"?
>
> Bro?

Nope....actually the government created special entities that fueled the unnatural growth of real estate values, while also creating programs to give homes to people who could not afford them.
Renaissance2K
Silver Good Trader Has Written 4 Reviews
* 13-Apr-2012(#75)
Reed wrote:
> Renaissance2K wrote:
>
>> I was under the impression that the banking failures and housing
> bubbles
>> were the result of deregulation. If anything, isn't that making
> the
>> government "smaller"?
>>
>> Bro?
>
> Nope....actually the government created special entities that fueled
> the unnatural growth of real estate values, while also creating programs
> to give homes to people who could not afford them.

Unless HUD insured trillions upon trillions of dollars worth of mortgages from unqualified buyers between 1998 and 2008, it's a negligible impact compared to what the larger banks were doing between 2000 and 2008 with the corruption of the ratings agencies, the growth of the CDS market, the time-bomb mortgage interest rates, and all the other ways that large banks tried to lock people into mortgages and pass the hot potato before it incinerated. All those things are practices that were enabled through deregulation or lack of oversight in the preceding ten years.

Sure, housing programs made an impact, but it completely ignores the bigger picture. It's like blaming global warming on reflective clothing.
Scott
It's a secret to everybody. GameTZ Subscriber Triple Gold Good Trader
Global Trader - willing to trade internationally Has Written 1 Review
13-Apr-2012(#76)
image
Reed
400 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
* 13-Apr-2012(#77)
"by 2008, before the crisis, half of the 54 million mortgages in the U.S. financial system were subprime and other low-quality mortgages."

http://www.usatoday.com/news/opinion/story/2011-11...

So I think you're down playing the role of government in real estate......Sure you can say a bunch of idiots that didnt know what a variable rate meant but signed the mortgage papers anyways was the cause, but that would make you look kinda dumb.

ShishioMakoto
GameTZ Gold Subscriber Triple Gold Good Trader
Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
13-Apr-2012(#78)
Ya. It is pretty hard to lay all of the fault on the lenders when ARM's aren't rocket science.

image
Osiris
GameTZ Subscriber 300 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader
13-Apr-2012(#79)
I am a strong Obama supporter because I think he is looking ahead on a number of things:

-Addressing health care costs for everyone, because 90 is the new 70, people live a long time and have high medical costs for those last 20 or 30 years.

-Understanding how important energy creation and conservation are to the current and future economy.

-Having a light hand in the Middle East, as democracy is breaking out all over the place there.

-Spending tax money to encourage new industries and technology. I think it's better a better way than sending families $1200 tax rebate checks.

-Working on strengthening the middle class, hardest hit by the economic crisis. The class war is already here.
metsfan718
Silver Good Trader
* 13-Apr-2012(#80)
Honestly I think things will eventually start booming again.The president for the next term has to make the right decisions though. Doesn't matter which party is in office. Also, while Obama is not the greatest president he got put a tough spot . He could of fudgeed up a lot worse and put us in a deeper hole. Like when he bailed GM out. Awesome decision that is helping us now and for the future. Now GM took over Toyota for #1. But America always rebounds regardless of which party is in office. And yeah I like to keep things positive sometimes  * smile * . Just some food for thought. I really don't have a valid opinion on either party. It would be actually cool to see an independent get elected. Long shot I know...

GTZ E Cig forum:
http://gametz.com/forum/USER%3A101978

Renaissance2K
Silver Good Trader Has Written 4 Reviews
* 13-Apr-2012(#81)
Reed wrote:
> "by 2008, before the crisis, half of the 54 million mortgages in the
> U.S. financial system were subprime and other low-quality mortgages."
>
>
> So I think you're down playing the role of government in real estate......Sure
> you can say a bunch of idiots that didnt know what a variable rate
> meant but signed the mortgage papers anyways was the cause, but that
> would make you look kinda dumb.

You want me to comment on an article posted by a senior fellow in a conservative think tank who disagrees with the official committee's opinion?

The article is unsourced (the link at the beginning of the article is just a download of his original published statement, dated "Janauary 2011", which itself is unsourced), obviously and blatantly biased (see above), and flies in the face of everything that honest analysis and detective work have concluded after looking into the crisis for four years. This is the equivalent of a report filed by somebody who thinks the moon landing was staged.

God, it's even written like a shill piece. 70% of half? Most sensible people call that 18.9%, but having the "70%" in there looks a Hell of a lot scarier.

Edit: Did you even look up the biography on that guy? He's been trying to bring down Fannie and Freddie for years. Of course he'd seize the opportunity to blame a huge financial crisis on them; he'd sell a ton of books that way. You barely need to page through the comments to find .gov-hosted documents that disprove the numbers that Wallison provides.
DaveSGE

(abuse)
13-Apr-2012(#82)
MikeyWhoa wrote:
> First off, thank you for making an educated list, instead of just
> name calling and bailing.
>
> dracula wrote:
>>
>>
>> Unemployment is up. It is over 8%. Higher than it has been since
>> Obama signed the NDAA on new years eve 2011, making it legal to
> arrest
>> citizens without a warrant.
>> The national debt is up to 16 TRILLION. It was 10 Trillion when
> obama
>> took office in january of 2009.
>> In an attempt to dilute the debt, we have increased the money supply
>> by printing up money. The Fed has lowered the interest rate to
> create
>> more inflation. The price of commodities in USA dollars is forced
>> up.
>>
>> So we have more debt, fewer jobs, less freedom, and a dollar is
> worth
>> a lot less than it was 4 years ago, effectively making all of us
> poorer.
>>
>> The Obama jobs bill did nothing to create jobs, but instead gave
> money
>> to special interest groups like >>">solyndra
>
> Debt is still skyrocketing up. No debate there.
>
> The recession began just as Bush left and Obama started. Unemployment
> shot up the moment he took office. If you want to blame Obama for
> that, then there is nothing I can say. It takes time to clean up a
> big mess. I don't think anyone could have done better when it comes
> to unemployment in that time. After the recession, the rate has dropped,
> albeit very slowly.
>
> >">Click here to see a chart of of the number of private jobs added
> since Obama took office. While admittedly yes, it's not ideal, it's
> certainly not worse.
>
>>
>> We also have Obamacare, could be a talking point for the 2012 election-
>> Ironically, the blueprint for obamacare came from romneycare in
> Massachusetts.
>> Over the summer, the supreme court will decide whether or not
> obamacare
>> is constitutional. One sticking point: people that don't want,
> or
>> need health care coverage(for example, healthy people age 18 to
> 25)
>> are forced to pay a mandatory tax penalty under obamacare. The
> bill
>> was rushed through congress, justices roberts and kennedy are apparently
>> the swing votes that will decide obamacare's fate..
>>
>
> While we can debate ideaology, I can't see the problem with having
> more peoples health covered. This again is not the ideal solution.
> It is however not worse to have more people covered.
>
> As far as his accomplishments go...
>
> Killed Osama
>
> Helped save the American Auto Industry (I'm no fan of bailouts, but
> results are results)
>
> Repealed "Don't Ask, Don't Tell"
>
> Instituted enforcement for equal pay for women
>
> Fully funded the Violence Against Women Act
>
> Established a credit card "Bill Of Rights"
>
> Reversed restrictions on stem cell research
>
> Ended War in Iraq
>
> Raised fuel economy standards
>
> Invest in alternative energy (Stopped ignoring Climate Change)
>
> Families of fallen soldiers have expenses covered to be on hand when
> the body arrives at Dover AFB
>
> List goes on...
>
> While I'm not %100 on board with Obama, he deserves more credit than
> people give him. There are definitely places he needs to improve,
> but given the situation I believe he has been a decent leader. It's
> got to be hard when the population is accusing you of being a socialist/communist
> muslim terrorist anti-christ. I have never seen so many negative attacks
> against a president. Just this past Wednesday, Foster Friess quipped
> that he hopes Obamas "teleprompters are bulletproof." I feel sorry
> for him.
>
>
>
>


Lol @ killed Osama and ended war in Iraq.
metsfan718
Silver Good Trader
13-Apr-2012(#83)
Yeah some people make him to be the worst president ever lmfao.

GTZ E Cig forum:
http://gametz.com/forum/USER%3A101978

MikeyWhoa
Double Gold Good Trader
13-Apr-2012(#84)
DaveSGE wrote:
> Lol @ killed Osama and ended war in Iraq.

Yes, you're right. Obama had nothing to do with those two issues.  * rolls eyes *




Currently enjoying...
image

DaveSGE

(abuse)
13-Apr-2012(#85)
Iraq has been requesting and pushing British and the United States armies out of Iraq for over a year....Obama didn't end fudge all, he *finally* listened to the Iraq government.
MikeyWhoa
Double Gold Good Trader
13-Apr-2012(#86)
DaveSGE wrote:
> Iraq has been requesting and pushing British and the United States
> armies out of Iraq for over a year....Obama didn't end fudge all, he
> *finally* listened to the Iraq government.

So, to sum up. Obama made the decision to leave. LolDave being LolDave.

Lol!




Currently enjoying...
image

Karaiya
Gold Good Trader Has Written 1 Review
13-Apr-2012(#87)
The Obama administration is baller dog just go with it.

image
thegreatest
Gold Good Trader Has Written 1 Review
13-Apr-2012(#88)
Lino wrote:
> You guys are all fudging retarded, seriously.
>
> Such short, short memories.
>
>
> First off, 9/11 has nothing to do with the economy. If anything, the
> Bush administration was using the age-old strategy that war improves
> the economy, but what was true in 1942 is not necessarily true today.
> Everyone with half a brain knew that an invasion into Iraq and Afghanistan
> would cripple our economy.
>
> Just like everyone with half a brain could see what was going to happen
> --
>
>
> 1. Obama inherits a crap storm from the previous guy
> 2. Is asked to fix it
> 3. Everyone forgets who made the mess
> 4. Then blames Obama for the mess
>
>
> This is why the liberals promote education so passionately. You guys
> forget this crap so quickly.
>
> Add to the fact that the right-wing have ADMITTED to being
> obstructionists to the president's plans, wishing that the country
> was in ruin just so that they can blame Obama...
>
>
>

Thank you. This has allowed me to not have to respond to the guy who posted what Obama has done to the country. Since everything he posted happened when Bush was in office.
DaveSGE

(abuse)
13-Apr-2012(#89)
MikeyWhoa wrote:
> DaveSGE wrote:
>> Iraq has been requesting and pushing British and the United States
>> armies out of Iraq for over a year....Obama didn't end fudge all,
> he
>> *finally* listened to the Iraq government.
>
> So, to sum up. Obama made the decision to leave. LolDave being LolDave.
>
> Lol!
>
>
>


LilMikey being LilMikey... End and leave aren't even remotely close to the same.

It's ok, you know as much about this as the NFL...so it's expected.
thegreatest
Gold Good Trader Has Written 1 Review
13-Apr-2012(#90)
What it comes down to is Bush "ended" the war in Iraq to make himself look better because the people were sick of the war. But in reality, the war didn't end until Obama decided to actually bring home the troops. You can say what you want, but Bush didn't end crap.
DaveSGE

(abuse)
13-Apr-2012(#91)
Nobody said Bush ended anything. The war in Iraq ended when their government was restored.
thegreatest
Gold Good Trader Has Written 1 Review
13-Apr-2012(#92)
DaveSGE wrote:
> Nobody said Bush ended anything. The war in Iraq ended when their
> government was restored.

So a war ends with a government being restored now? That makes perfect sense. I'm pretty sure a war ends when troops are withdrawn and hopefully a treaty is signed. As far as I have heard no treaty has been signed. I could be wrong though.
IlovePhysics
Double Gold Good Trader
13-Apr-2012(#93)
thegreatest wrote:
> Lino wrote:
>> Such short, short memories....
>> Add to the fact that the right-wing have ADMITTED to being
>> obstructionists to the president's plans, wishing that the country
>> was in ruin just so that they can blame Obama...
>>

> Thank you. This has allowed me to not have to respond to the guy who
> posted what Obama has done to the country. Since everything he posted
> happened when Bush was in office.

Ok, here's my take; First, I haven't really seen anyone reference the Bush tax cuts from the standpoint of something that is easily on the Trillion dollar scale of what is needed to fix the problem, but clearly no political party is foolish enough to touch as far as repealing... Probably have an easier time asking for every American to have a tooth pulled... No one wants the ugly truth that we cannot always keep lowering taxes if we keep wanting to fight wars (gotta pay for it somehow, right?).. Yet, on the other side, this whole 'Buffet' argument sounds good to 98% of us, but honestly the savings would be chump change (what, $250B) compared to what we've (everyone else) been getting as far as a taxcut ever since Bush took over (and again, and again under Obama).. Granted, the alternative Ryan budget situation/parade now is even more comical as a 'obviously they knew the Senate won't pass it / no compromise bill'.... because does anyone really believe lowering a millionaire's tax rates (and not doing much of anything to adjust anyone elses') really supports a 'job creator'? Seriously? That's the best Ryan can claim? Really, don't business and companies (and, well, demand for goods/services, cash flow to innovate ideas and newer products people don't even know they want yet, etc.) 'create' jobs, not the highest salaries of the smallest percentage of the limited individuals running the largest of them (so as to actually be in those upper 0.2% brackets anyway)? Why can't we seem to divorce 'individual' income taxes from 'business' taxes? It would seem that the less a business got taxed, the more it could pay people at the top anyway (who are in charge), so they'd simply get all the money they lost back in an indirect way...

Now, the fact that Simpson-Bowles was pretty much laughed at by the House (both sides) is even more telling of how crappy things are... you'd think these people / Representatives would want to pass *something* that was actually a fairly universally accepted 'step in the right direction' (even just if only to not let the perfect be the enemy of the good). But of course not. That would be 'compromise' and that wasn't perfect... and obviously that cannot fly. I fault the GOP more for this because it really fell on them while also knowing the whole time they really will not work with Obama at all (because, frankly, they know the American people care about taxes, job rate and gas prices... not working with the president helps keep all of those problematic)... they probably could have drafted something 'close' that would have put a lot of pressure on the DEMs. Instead, they need an all-or-nothing approach that they know will never fly... I don't blame the speaker, just the fact that their right wing won't pass anything that isn't perfect is just political BS 'hoping' they'll take over eventually... while everyone who they represents basically suffers as a consequence.. And it isn't like the 2010 elections in the midterm suggested that the GOPers (especially at the blue collar state level, aka, Mich, Ohio, Virginia, ) won't do exactly the same thing the DEMS did between 2008-2010 at the federal level... aka, get elected on some mandate completely different, then pass 'social' laws that had nothing to do with the original message of the campaigns...

Honestly, there are some elements of GOP plans (fiscally) I actually like... These concepts of getting rid of capitol gains taxes on people making less than $200K, etc., seem to make sense... encourage money from actual middle class people. I actually don't disagree with a lower 'gains' tax rate anyway, provided the investments were actually those into US-based corporations that kept jobs here.. as in, why can't we add incentives / programs to this that make certain investments back into the US better or more favorable tax wise than those to corporations based elsewhere (or with a remote/outsourced heavy workforce)?... seems like a win-win and would be something that actually helps job creation here in the US because of the incentives. I would love to know that my money was going back into the US *and* people were getting jobs because of it *and* I was getting a tax break as part of the deal...

I mean let's look at a guy like Romney. Say he only paid 13% taxes, but that was because a vast majority of his investments were made back into companies that created jobs in the US (and could actually be traceable). This is probably already true anyway, but never really gets brought up... Would he seem all that bad as that portrait of someone who (media portrayal) is possibly hiding money offshore, or made millions on companies that were strictly outsourcing jobs?
Karaiya
Gold Good Trader Has Written 1 Review
* 13-Apr-2012(#94)
image

image
Ronin
GameTZ Subscriber 300 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader
13-Apr-2012(#95)
metsfan718 wrote:
> Yeah some people make him to be the worst president ever lmfao.
>
>

Isnt every president the worst president ever? People said it about bush and theyll say it about romney or whoever is in there after the current worst president ever. The president is a scape goat to blame for every problem the country has so we dont have to blame ourselves, and then when the next guy gets elected we can go, gee i miss the last guy, the new one is the worst ever. Things arent much different under Obama and they wont be under Romney or whoever.
image
DaveSGE

(abuse)
13-Apr-2012(#96)
thegreatest wrote:
> DaveSGE wrote:
>> Nobody said Bush ended anything. The war in Iraq ended when their
>> government was restored.
>
> So a war ends with a government being restored now? That makes perfect
> sense. I'm pretty sure a war ends when troops are withdrawn and hopefully
> a treaty is signed. As far as I have heard no treaty has been signed.
> I could be wrong though.


This is where common sense becomes your friend...what kind of treaty would you like to see?

This wasn't the War AGAINST Iraq...it was the War IN Iraq...there is absolutely no reason to sign a treaty when no nations were at war against one another. Iraq was simply the war zone and nothing more. The entire point of the war was WMDs which didn't exist, the secondary part was to remove Saddam from control...which happened...So, it only makes sense that once the government was restored without Saddam, the war was ended.
metsfan718
Silver Good Trader
* 13-Apr-2012(#97)
Ronin wrote:
> metsfan718 wrote:
>> Yeah some people make him to be the worst president ever
> lmfao.
>>
>>
>
> Isnt every president the worst president ever? People said
> it about bush and theyll say it about romney or whoever
> is in there after the current worst president ever. The
> president is a scape goat to blame for every problem the
> country has so we dont have to blame ourselves, and then
> when the next guy gets elected we can go, gee i miss the
> last guy, the new one is the worst ever. Things arent much
> different under Obama and they wont be under Romney or whoever.
>
Agreed. Like I said I don't really care much about politics. Every president spits out the propaganda and lies. You have to do that though in order to be elected.I think some presidents are more likable than others though. Also some presidents had bigger tasks that were accomplished which is a contributing factor to their popularity. Of course it's impossible to accomplish everything that comes out their mouths in their defense.


GTZ E Cig forum:
http://gametz.com/forum/USER%3A101978

Nuke
Quadruple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
13-Apr-2012(#98)
fudge this thread
Ronin
GameTZ Subscriber 300 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader
13-Apr-2012(#99)
Nuke wrote:
> impeach this thread


image
metsfan718
Silver Good Trader
13-Apr-2012(#100)
Last two posts  * yes *

GTZ E Cig forum:
http://gametz.com/forum/USER%3A101978

dracula
Has Written 7 Reviews
(abandoned)
13-Apr-2012(#101)
Lino wrote:
> When we say "the economy was effected" I'm assuming that we're all
> talking about the nation's economy, not the city of NY.
>
> Obviously, there's a little windfall from a huge disaster. And of
> course, markets were effected, investors were afraid and more conservative,
> but those were only initial and immediate responses to the tragedy.
> Nothing was really affected permanently.


the airline industry was affected permanently.
psx_4
GameTZ Subscriber 350 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
* 13-Apr-2012(#102)
Look these up all signed by Obama
Obama can enact any of these anytime he feels like it
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
MARTIAL LAW ANYONE
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Executive Order 10995: All communications media are to be seized by the Federal Government. Radio, TV, newspapers, CB, Ham, telephones, and the internet will be under federal control. Hence, the First Amendment will be suspended indefinitely.
Executive Order 10997: All electrical power, fuels, and all minerals well be seized by the federal government.
Executive Order 10998: All food resources, farms and farm equipment will be seized by the government. You will not be allowed to hoard food since this is regulated. (Made a change that would allow Barack Obama to do this even in “non-emergency” situations)
Executive Order 10999: All modes of transportation will go into government control. Any vehicle can be seized.
Executive Order 11000: All civilians can be used for work under federal supervision.
Executive Order 11490: Establishes presidential control over all US citizens, businesses, and churches in time of "emergency."
Executive Order 12919: Directs various Cabinet officials to be constantly ready to take over virtually all aspects of the US economy during a State of National Emergency at the direction of the president.
Executive Order 13010: Directs FEMA to take control over all government agencies in time of emergency. FEMA is under control of executive branch of the government.
Executive Order 12656: "ASSIGNMENT OF EMERGENCY PREPAREDNESS RESPONSIBILITIES", "A national emergency is any occurrence, including natural disaster, military attack, technological emergency, or other emergency that seriously degrades or seriously threatens the national security of the United States. Policy for national security emergency preparedness shall be established by the President." This order includes federal takeover of all local law enforcement agencies, wage and price controls, prohibits you from moving assets in or out of the United States, creates a draft, controls all travel in and out of the United States, and much more.
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
TheDoctor
GameTZ Gold Subscriber 1000 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader
13-Apr-2012(#103)
Careful now, don't stick to your crazy guns too long or people will think you're Ron Paul.
psx_4
GameTZ Subscriber 350 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
* 14-Apr-2012(#104)
The evidence is clear. I am crazy for presenting what is happening right now. When they start taking away my rights as an American I'm crazy.
So it is okay for the government to steal my land, my property, take away my kids without probable cause. Tyranny - an excessive use of authority and power so they can get a power-trip. Taking away my rights and soft-filling me with GMO's and others.
This is not the America our for fathers envisioned. We are so close to becoming a Totalitarian Dictatorship and in some sick way we see signs heading that way.
They are causing the problem we now have so that they can come in and say "Oh we have a solution to that, We will take away more of your right to keep you secure" when they are the ones that caused it in the first place.
TYRANNY It's happening in your own backyard, but you call it security. Not me its time for a Revolution of being informed and getting others informed as well.
Ronin
GameTZ Subscriber 300 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader
14-Apr-2012(#105)
Who crap in your cereal this morning dude?

image
ShishioMakoto
GameTZ Gold Subscriber Triple Gold Good Trader
Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
* 14-Apr-2012(#106)
Looks like Obama. Uh.. I'm guessing.

image
TheDoctor
GameTZ Gold Subscriber 1000 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader
14-Apr-2012(#107)
You make good points but sounding like a whack job doesnt help your case. Hence the Ron Paul crack. Its best to keep that kind of talk to yourself. Spouting it will not make people side with you, but instead drive them away.

Yes these presidential powers exist. You know what makes a better president? The fact that the guy I'm rooting for isn't sitting around using them. If he looses and your guy gets in office, he will likely use them and often. Maybe even add more. I'm sure you will change your tune then and find some way of justifying it.

The founding fathers would spit on both sides of the aisle. This whole bit about Republicans treating corporations like people would boil their blood. That's one thing the democrats have going for them. Try to find a republican running solely on their own merit and absolutely no financial gain or corporate interests. They don't exist anymore. Don't even say Ron Paul, hes not a real republican anyway. The only real republican was Rick Santorum and hes out.
psx_4
GameTZ Subscriber 350 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
14-Apr-2012(#108)
Just keep your eyes and ears open to the things that I have mentioned. Because the New World Order is here and It will get worse than it already is.
Get informed on the Constitution and your rights will be your friend.
TheDoctor
GameTZ Gold Subscriber 1000 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader
14-Apr-2012(#109)
You're sounding like an advertisement for Hillsdale College.
dracula
Has Written 7 Reviews
(abandoned)
14-Apr-2012(#110)
SirConnery wrote:
> You make good points but sounding like a whack job doesnt help your
> case. Hence the Ron Paul crack. Its best to keep that kind of talk
> to yourself. Spouting it will not make people side with you, but instead
> drive them away.
>
> Yes these presidential powers exist. You know what makes a better
> president? The fact that the guy I'm rooting for isn't sitting around
> using them. If he looses and your guy gets in office, he will likely
> use them and often. Maybe even add more.


What exactly are you basing that on. In one sentence, you say its bad to talk totally paranoid and then 3 sentences later you add your own irrational paranoia and don't even bother trying to back any of it up..



I'm sure you will change
> your tune then and find some way of justifying it.
>
> The founding fathers would spit on both sides of the aisle. This whole
> bit about Republicans treating corporations like people would boil
> their blood. That's one thing the democrats have going for them. Try
> to find a republican running solely on their own merit and absolutely
> no financial gain or corporate interests. They don't exist anymore.
> Don't even say Ron Paul, hes not a real republican anyway.


he has run on the republican party ticket for congress for all of his terms in congress, though Paul has questioned his place in the party.


The only
> real republican was Rick Santorum and hes out.


Funny, I would say that santorum and romney are not real republicans because they arent conservative fiscally.
Lino
I am YOU are me GameTZ Subscriber Silver Good Trader
Has Written 2 Reviews
14-Apr-2012(#111)
DaveSGE wrote:
>
>
> Lol @ killed Osama and ended war in Iraq.

Bush had a nice photo op aboard that naval ship claiming victory in Iraq 5 years before the war ended. Think about the 3-year long parade George Bush woulda had if he got Osama?



 * poker face *
DaveSGE

(abuse)
14-Apr-2012(#112)
Lino wrote:
> DaveSGE wrote:
>>
>>
>> Lol @ killed Osama and ended war in Iraq.
>
> Bush had a nice photo op aboard that naval ship claiming victory in
> Iraq 5 years before the war ended. Think about the 3-year long parade
> George Bush woulda had if he got Osama?
>
>
>
>


The war did end 5 years ago. The entire point of the "war" was to remove Saddam Heussein from power and to eliminate the imagined threat of WMDs that didn't exist.

Just because troops remain to restore complete order doesn't change when the war actually ended. The United States stayed in Germany much later than 1945, but World War II ended when Hitler died.
Lino
I am YOU are me GameTZ Subscriber Silver Good Trader
Has Written 2 Reviews
14-Apr-2012(#113)
psx_4 wrote:
> Look these up all signed by Obama
> Obama can enact any of these anytime he feels like it
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> MARTIAL LAW ANYONE
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
> Executive Order 10995: All communications media are to be seized by
> the Federal Government. Radio, TV, newspapers, CB, Ham, telephones,
> and the internet will be under federal control. Hence, the First Amendment
> will be suspended indefinitely.
> Executive Order 10997: All electrical power, fuels, and all minerals
> well be seized by the federal government.
> Executive Order 10998: All food resources, farms and farm equipment
> will be seized by the government. You will not be allowed to hoard
> food since this is regulated. (Made a change that would allow Barack
> Obama to do this even in “non-emergency” situations)
> Executive Order 10999: All modes of transportation will go into government
> control. Any vehicle can be seized.
> Executive Order 11000: All civilians can be used for work under federal
> supervision.
> Executive Order 11490: Establishes presidential control over all US
> citizens, businesses, and churches in time of "emergency."
> Executive Order 12919: Directs various Cabinet officials to be constantly
> ready to take over virtually all aspects of the US economy during
> a State of National Emergency at the direction of the president.
> Executive Order 13010: Directs FEMA to take control over all government
> agencies in time of emergency. FEMA is under control of executive
> branch of the government.
> Executive Order 12656: "ASSIGNMENT OF EMERGENCY PREPAREDNESS RESPONSIBILITIES",
> "A national emergency is any occurrence, including natural disaster,
> military attack, technological emergency, or other emergency that
> seriously degrades or seriously threatens the national security of
> the United States. Policy for national security emergency preparedness
> shall be established by the President." This order includes federal
> takeover of all local law enforcement agencies, wage and price controls,
> prohibits you from moving assets in or out of the United States, creates
> a draft, controls all travel in and out of the United States, and
> much more.
> -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


This is as old as Abe Lincoln.

http://libertyforlife.com/constitution/executive/e...

Check this page out for all of the executive orders passed by presidents for the last 150 years. Everything from Roosevelt demanding all citizens hand over their gold to a private bank to Bush's Patriot Act allowing arrests without trial, wiretapping, etc.

Crap, I think Bush even passed something allowing for the creation of the $Amero, a united dollar between Canada, U.S. and Mexico.


I wouldn't be worried, it's out of your hands and something every president has done incrementally. Remember the president still needs Congress approval during emergency situations.




 * poker face *
Lino
I am YOU are me GameTZ Subscriber Silver Good Trader
Has Written 2 Reviews
* 14-Apr-2012(#114)
DaveSGE wrote:
> Lino wrote:
>> DaveSGE wrote:
> |>>
> |>>
> |>> Lol @ killed Osama and ended war in Iraq.
>>
>> Bush had a nice photo op aboard that naval ship claiming victory
> in
>> Iraq 5 years before the war ended. Think about the 3-year long
> parade
>> George Bush woulda had if he got Osama?
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
> The war did end 5 years ago. The entire point of the "war" was to
> remove Saddam Heussein from power and to eliminate the imagined threat
> of WMDs that didn't exist.
>
> Just because troops remain to restore complete order doesn't change
> when the war actually ended. The United States stayed in Germany much
> later than 1945, but World War II ended when Hitler died.

Fine, I'll give you that.

But you did laugh out loud when he mentioned Osama being killed. Isn't what you did there just as lol-worthy??



 * poker face *
DaveSGE

(abuse)
14-Apr-2012(#115)
Lino wrote:
> DaveSGE wrote:
>> Lino wrote:
> |>> DaveSGE wrote:
>> |>>
>> |>>
>> |>> Lol @ killed Osama and ended war in Iraq.
> |>>
> |>> Bush had a nice photo op aboard that naval ship claiming victory
>> in
> |>> Iraq 5 years before the war ended. Think about the 3-year long
>> parade
> |>> George Bush woulda had if he got Osama?
> |>>
> |>>
> |>>
> |>>
>>
>>
>> The war did end 5 years ago. The entire point of the "war" was
> to
>> remove Saddam Heussein from power and to eliminate the imagined
> threat
>> of WMDs that didn't exist.
>>
>> Just because troops remain to restore complete order doesn't change
>> when the war actually ended. The United States stayed in Germany
> much
>> later than 1945, but World War II ended when Hitler died.
>
> Fine, I'll give you that.
>
> But you did laugh out loud when he mentioned Osama being killed. Isn't
> what you did there just as lol-worthy??
>
>
>
>


To give credit to Obama for the death of Osama Bin Laden is a joke. For one, the President was sitting in a small room when Osama was killed, he wasn't holding a gun, he wasn't on location with Team Six and he was tipped off that Bin Laden was even holding up in the compound -- it's not like he said, "Check this area out, I believe he could be there."

Secondly, let's not discredit the fact that Bush had had a tremendous amount of ground already covered and checked for the last 10 years looking for this man. It's not as if Obama came in fresh and Bin Laden had never even been pursued. Obama was given a ridiculously significant smaller portion of ground to cover in the search for Bin Laden and honestly, one man can only hide for so long before he's eventually found. Especially when the area to find him is so small in comparison to the relative size of the Earth.

Allowing Obama to take credit for this "find and kill" deployment is absolutely absurd. The only people who should be given credit for the death of Osama Bin Laden is the thousands of soldiers who died searching for him, the millions of soldiers in the Middle East who went looking for him and Team Six, the guys who finally pulled the trigger.

I wasn't a huge fan of Bush, but I do feel bad that this guy got the short end of the stick entirely and was probably dealt the worst Presidential hand of poker in the history of the country (9/11, Katrina, Afghanistan, faulty Iraq information, etc...). I'm also no fan of Obama either, but also feel bad he got left with the crap covered stick Bush was dealt with as well. They both were put into terrible situations that neither could really avoid -- but I don't feel like Obama has really taken any big steps in reversing the misfortune he was added... Instead of all of the family vacations, NCAA brackets being filled out, Air Force One trips to campaign (more than any other President in history), etc... he should have been working for the change he pushed during his original Presidential campaign.

I believe the country is fudgeed regardless of how anyone wants to vote in 2012 because it's still going to end up either Democrat or Republican and at this point, both sides are poison to the country. Nothing is going to change until people realize that they're running a UNITED States of America and not a Divided States of America based on their political affiliation.
Lino
I am YOU are me GameTZ Subscriber Silver Good Trader
Has Written 2 Reviews
* 14-Apr-2012(#116)
DaveSGE wrote:
>
>
> To give credit to Obama for the death of Osama Bin Laden is a joke.
> For one, the President was sitting in a small room when Osama was
> killed, he wasn't holding a gun, he wasn't on location with Team Six
> and he was tipped off that Bin Laden was even holding up in the compound
> -- it's not like he said, "Check this area out, I believe he could
> be there."
>

No man, this counts. For the same reasoning that a president would ever get credit for anything. If he's in office when some good crap goes down, he gets credit for it. McCain woulda took credit for it, had he won election. And you can bet your ass they wouldn't let you forget who's presidency got him.


and let's be real here, I wouldn't give Obama credit for it anyway. Osama bin Laden died a long fudgein time ago, he may have even been dead before the events of 9/11. He was just a boogeyman, a scapegoat, they knew about it b/c the bin Laden family that was living in the U.S. at the time were flown out of the U.S. just a day or two after 9/11. At a time when there were no flights allowed at all for those few days. However, Osama didn't actually release his tape claiming responsibility til at least a week after the event. Something was always really, really fishy about that whole thing and the conspiracies will never end.



> Secondly, let's not discredit the fact that Bush had had a tremendous
> amount of ground already covered and checked for the last 10 years
> looking for this man. It's not as if Obama came in fresh and Bin Laden
> had never even been pursued. Obama was given a ridiculously significant
> smaller portion of ground to cover in the search for Bin Laden and
> honestly, one man can only hide for so long before he's eventually
> found. Especially when the area to find him is so small in comparison
> to the relative size of the Earth.
>

Ok.

> Allowing Obama to take credit for this "find and kill" deployment
> is absolutely absurd. The only people who should be given credit for
> the death of Osama Bin Laden is the thousands of soldiers who died
> searching for him, the millions of soldiers in the Middle East who
> went looking for him and Team Six, the guys who finally pulled the
> trigger.
>

Those soldiers died serving their country and the commander in chief.

> I wasn't a huge fan of Bush, but I do feel bad that this guy got the
> short end of the stick entirely and was probably dealt the worst Presidential
> hand of poker in the history of the country (9/11, Katrina, Afghanistan,
> faulty Iraq information, etc...). I'm also no fan of Obama either,
> but also feel bad he got left with the crap covered stick Bush was
> dealt with as well. They both were put into terrible situations that
> neither could really avoid -- but I don't feel like Obama has really
> taken any big steps in reversing the misfortune he was added... Instead
> of all of the family vacations, NCAA brackets being filled out, Air
> Force One trips to campaign (more than any other President in history),
> etc... he should have been working for the change he pushed during
> his original Presidential campaign.
>

Bush couldn't come through during 9/11, his air defense failed. During Katrina he allowed state/federal squabbles to waste time before the city could get real help. Afghanistan/Iraq was his own fault, I mean, everyone knew we were there under false pretenses. It's funny how half the country, without any kind of military intelligence, could just KNOW that Iraq had no wmd's and we were making a huge mistake that we couldn't pay for. How is it that any old soccer mom knew the exact outcome of what Iraq would be and the Bush administration didn't? She's checking her farmville, they're checking the desert, and soccer mom knew better.

> I believe the country is fudgeed regardless of how anyone wants to
> vote in 2012 because it's still going to end up either Democrat or
> Republican and at this point, both sides are poison to the country.
> Nothing is going to change until people realize that they're running
> a UNITED States of America and not a Divided States of America based
> on their political affiliation.

I'll agree with most of that.

But what options do we have currently? I think I'd rather go with the side that at least pretends to give a crap. Dude, the right wing, the wealthy, they don't give a fudge about you. You're an insect. You'd be working 100 hour work weeks with no overtime if it was up to them. There's a reason why we have regulations on big business. There's a reason why liberals are concerned about the environment, healthcare, etc. We don't wanna see people starve. Where do you think they'll all go when the streets are full? You think your gated community's gonna do anything?

We the people.

Not we the corporations.

At least the government pledges allegiance to the flag, like me and you do. Business holds no allegiances to anything other than itself.


 * poker face *
dracula
Has Written 7 Reviews
(abandoned)
* 15-Apr-2012(#117)
Lino wrote:
> DaveSGE wrote:
>>
>>
>> To give credit to Obama for the death of Osama Bin Laden is a joke.
>> For one, the President was sitting in a small room when Osama was
>> killed, he wasn't holding a gun, he wasn't on location with Team
> Six
>> and he was tipped off that Bin Laden was even holding up in the
> compound
>> -- it's not like he said, "Check this area out, I believe he could
>> be there."
>>
>
> No man, this counts. For the same reasoning that a president would
> ever get credit for anything. If he's in office when some good crap
> goes down, he gets credit for it. McCain woulda took credit for it,
> had he won election. And you can bet your ass they wouldn't let you
> forget who's presidency got him.
>
> ...
>
>> Secondly, let's not discredit the fact that Bush had had a tremendous
>> amount of ground already covered and checked for the last 10 years
>> looking for this man. It's not as if Obama came in fresh and Bin
> Laden
>> had never even been pursued. Obama was given a ridiculously significant
>> smaller portion of ground to cover in the search for Bin Laden
> and
>> honestly, one man can only hide for so long before he's eventually
>> found. Especially when the area to find him is so small in comparison
>> to the relative size of the Earth.
>>
>
> Ok.
>
>> Allowing Obama to take credit for this "find and kill" deployment
>> is absolutely absurd. The only people who should be given credit
> for
>> the death of Osama Bin Laden is the thousands of soldiers who died
>> searching for him, the millions of soldiers in the Middle East
> who
>> went looking for him and Team Six, the guys who finally pulled
> the
>> trigger.
>>
>
> Those soldiers died serving their country and the commander in chief.
>
>
>> I wasn't a huge fan of Bush, but I do feel bad that this guy got
> the
>> short end of the stick entirely and was probably dealt the worst
> Presidential
>> hand of poker in the history of the country (9/11, Katrina, Afghanistan,
>> faulty Iraq information, etc...). I'm also no fan of Obama either,
>> but also feel bad he got left with the crap covered stick Bush
> was
>> dealt with as well. They both were put into terrible situations
> that
>> neither could really avoid -- but I don't feel like Obama has really
>> taken any big steps in reversing the misfortune he was added...
> Instead
>> of all of the family vacations, NCAA brackets being filled out,
> Air
>> Force One trips to campaign (more than any other President in history),
>> etc... he should have been working for the change he pushed during
>> his original Presidential campaign.
>>
>
> Bush couldn't come through during 9/11, his air defense failed. During
> Katrina he allowed state/federal squabbles to waste time before the
> city could get real help. Afghanistan/Iraq was his own fault, I mean,
> everyone knew we were there under false pretenses. It's funny how
> half the country, without any kind of military intelligence, could
> just KNOW that Iraq had no wmd's and we were making a huge mistake
> that we couldn't pay for. How is it that any old soccer mom knew the
> exact outcome of what Iraq would be and the Bush administration didn't?
> She's checking her farmville, they're checking the desert, and soccer
> mom knew better.
>
>> I believe the country is fudgeed regardless of how anyone wants
> to
>> vote in 2012 because it's still going to end up either Democrat
> or
>> Republican and at this point, both sides are poison to the country.
>> Nothing is going to change until people realize that they're running
>> a UNITED States of America and not a Divided States of America
> based
>> on their political affiliation.
>
> I'll agree with most of that.
>
> But what options do we have currently?


Things are changing, the younger generation is more aware of the 16 Trillion dollar debt we have amassed, most likely because we will be the ones paying it off. Regardless of whether or not Ron Paul wins the republican nomination or runs as a 3rd party, I am writing his name in on my ballot in November.

Obama and Romney are so similar as far as Foreign policy, monetary policy, even health care, it's like they are the same candidate.

I hope it happens in 2012, that we get some real change, but we are more aware than in 2008.

edit
as for giving Obama credit for killing osama bin laden: Obama still is keeping over 100,000 troops in afghanistan. Nothing changed with Osama's death. If Obama had said "ok now that Osama is dead, I am going to start bringing the troops home", that I would have actually respected. Instead, the Obama wars continue. Invading other countries just makes them hate us more and gives them reasons to become terrorists. The entire war in Afghanistan was a fool's errand from the start, there is no end to it.
Lino
I am YOU are me GameTZ Subscriber Silver Good Trader
Has Written 2 Reviews
17-Apr-2012(#118)
It's pretty scary.



 * poker face *

Topic   Impeach Obama 2012