| | | Author | Message |
|---|
Guru
  
| | #1 posted November 2, 2007 at 7:40pm (EST) |
This topic had many older posts which were moved here:
http://gametz.com/forum/VideoGame_Discussion/topic...
| colon
 
| | #121 posted November 18, 2007 at 3:02pm (EST) |
Yeah I haven't experienced any lag either in UMK, that's great. 
Puzzle Kombat still sucks though. | Jeffro
  
| #122 posted November 18, 2007 at 3:02pm (EST)
edited November 18, 2007 at 3:04pm (EST) |
Admiral wrote:
> I agree with Ben. It's not like the story is that tough
> to follow. The company is shady with its science work
> (teleporting), a problem occurs and Freeman tries to
> escape. The govt sends in troops to cover it all up,
> and when Freeman escapes and stops the teleporting
> with the aliens, the govt offers him a job.
>
> That's it. I guess the story COULD be interesting,
> but the way the games tells the story is boring. 
The story is presented to you through the games environment and Valve did an amazing job of immersing the player in this environment. The story surrounds the player and its the exact same way in Half-Life 2. Its not their fault that people have no imagination these days.
The best ways to tell a story arent necessarily the most direct.
P.S. Serious Sam is fudging garbage.
YOUR SUCH A SUPER LADY!! | benstylus
  
| | #123 posted November 18, 2007 at 3:28pm (EST) |
Jeffro wrote:
> P.S. Serious Sam is fudging garbage.
It's fast paced, fun, and doesn't take itself seriously, despite its name.
Plus the sheer number of enemies you face at once in the game (on the higher difficulties anyway) should bring a smile to even the hardest of hardcore shooter fans.
Tired of talking about the stuff? Visit the
Game Design & Mechanics Forum
to talk about the other stuff! | virtuadept
(frozen)
| | #124 posted November 18, 2007 at 3:33pm (EST) |
Admiral wrote:
> I agree with Ben. It's not like the story is that tough to follow.
> The company is shady with its science work (teleporting), a problem
> occurs and Freeman tries to escape. The govt sends in troops to cover
> it all up, and when Freeman escapes and stops the teleporting with
> the aliens, the govt offers him a job.
>
> That's it. I guess the story COULD be interesting, but the way the
> games tells the story is boring.
big white whale shows up, captain goes psycho chasing it and kills everyone trying. the end.
any story can be summed up in a one-liner that makes it sound boring as hell.
Visit virtuadept's RPG forum! or virtuadept's blog! | benstylus
| #125 posted November 18, 2007 at 3:44pm (EST)
edited November 18, 2007 at 3:46pm (EST) |
virtuadept wrote:
> Admiral wrote:
>> I agree with Ben. It's not like the story is that tough to follow.
>> The company is shady with its science work (teleporting), a problem
>> occurs and Freeman tries to escape. The govt sends in troops to
> cover
>> it all up, and when Freeman escapes and stops the teleporting with
>> the aliens, the govt offers him a job.
>>
>> That's it. I guess the story COULD be interesting, but the way
> the
>> games tells the story is boring.
>
> big white whale shows up, captain goes psycho chasing it and kills
> everyone trying. the end.
>
> any story can be summed up in a one-liner that makes it sound boring
> as hell.
But how much of the story do you actually experience in Half-Life? Most of the story in Half-Life is past tense. During the "Gordon trying to escape" (the main part of the game) you get to piece together some things about the events that led up to the game, but most of it isn't really related to the events (or lack thereof) taking place within the game. And even when you do figure it out, it doesn't have any relevance to what you're doing (except, perhaps, during the final boss fight), as evidenced by the amazingly craptacular ending to the game.
Even the expansions don't do much of anything to flesh out the story - they just sort of tell the "Gordon's Escape" story from different points of view.
Tired of talking about the stuff? Visit the
Game Design & Mechanics Forum
to talk about the other stuff! | colon
| | #126 posted November 18, 2007 at 3:45pm (EST) |
Admiral wrote:
> Haven't played Serious Sam, but it does look like Garbage.
It isn't! | SmarmySir
| | #127 posted November 18, 2007 at 4:02pm (EST) |
Half-Life 2 is superior to Half-Life in every way. | Guru
| | #128 posted November 18, 2007 at 4:34pm (EST) |
Sounds like Serious Sam is SEROIUSLY Gay! | virtuadept
(frozen)
| | #129 posted November 18, 2007 at 5:53pm (EST) |
HL is in the FPS genre. it has a better story than 90+% of the FPS games that came before it, and at least half the games that came after it. it's not supposed to be a frickin' RPG or an adventure game with a strong, detailed plot. FPS games are more about killing crap and stuff. maybe if you only rate games based on story alone a 6/10 is okay, but that's like rating hookers based on how well they can spell.
| benstylus
| | #130 posted November 18, 2007 at 6:01pm (EST) |
virtuadept wrote:
> HL is in the FPS genre. it has a better story than 90+% of the FPS
> games that came before it, and at least half the games that came after
> it. it's not supposed to be a frickin' RPG or an adventure game with
> a strong, detailed plot. FPS games are more about killing crap and
> stuff. maybe if you only rate games based on story alone a 6/10 is
> okay, but that's like rating hookers based on how well they can spell.
>
The in-game story is no better or worse than most FPS games. It's just the backstory that it has over most of them.
I just don't see why people get so hung up on how great half-life's story was when there really wasn't much of one in the game.
Tired of talking about the stuff? Visit the
Game Design & Mechanics Forum
to talk about the other stuff! | virtuadept
(frozen)
| | #131 posted November 18, 2007 at 6:07pm (EST) |
please stop trying to remove part of what made HL special by saying "that's just the backstory, that's not the in-game story". that's just a load of crap. you find out about the story through things that happen in the game, and slowly put it together. just because it's not spelled out for you with a blatant cut scene doesn't make it any less part of the game.
| sgtshaggy
 
| | #132 posted November 18, 2007 at 6:20pm (EST) |
It's interesting to hear the different opinions on Half-Life. I do, of course, totally disagree with Admiral and Ben--it's an amazing experience, from beginning to end, and simplifying the experience to "fighting aliens in hallways" x 100 is ludicrous. I have very fond memories of the different areas and enemy combinations, like the helicopter by the cliff or the troopers in the underground tram area, or having to surface with all the troops above. The story is great for what it is, which was something that had never been done before in an FPS--it was immersive. Not point A to point B, get a key, back to point A, but YOU were actually INVOLVED in the events. It's not the story so much but feeling like you were actually a part of the universe instead of being some faceless, nameless Quake badass blasting the doors off churchs and impaling demons. It was so much better than anything that came before, and set the tone for everything that came after. It was an important game, and fokkin' amazing too...probably pales in comparison to some of the FPS nowadays, but still damned good.
shags
 | j_factor
| #133 posted November 18, 2007 at 6:26pm (EST)
edited November 18, 2007 at 6:27pm (EST) |
I don't think he's talking about "story" in a strict sense of the word, but in a broader sense. Maybe "narrative" is a better word to use. The point is that playing Half-Life doesn't tell you an interesting story. Which would be fine if it were a pure action game, but it seems to present itself as if it had an interesting plot. And as a pure action game it's not the best either, with a lot of boring, repetitive levels set in uninteresting locales. It seems so generic at times.
Half-life's multiplayer and mods may have been incredible for the time (I don't really know, I'm not into that stuff at all), but I really don't think its main single-player game is exceptional. I know it got a lot of glowing reviews, but when I played it, I didn't see how it was any better than System Shock 2.
"To anyone who knew me better
Know I chose Saturn first 'cause it’s 2D heaven
Bernie Stolar dropped the ball with the RAM cartridge
X-men Vs. Street Fighter could’ve expanded the market"
-- Del | virtuadept
(frozen)
| | #134 posted November 18, 2007 at 6:30pm (EST) |
it's a million miles better than Quake in just about every department. i'd agree that SS2 is a better game (once it was patched to fix some of the most annoying stuff), but it came out a year later.
| j_factor
| | #135 posted November 18, 2007 at 6:54pm (EST) |
virtuadept wrote:
> i'd agree that SS2 is a better game (once it
> was patched to fix some of the most annoying stuff), but
> it came out a year later.
>
I didn't play Half-Life until 2000, but when I did, I was not impressed. If it's a case of, you had to have been there and played it right when it first came out, then it couldn't have been that great.
Half-Life is so linear it could've been made with the Doom engine. Unlike Shags, I didn't feel like I was "involved" in the events, simply because the game didn't allow me to make any game-affecting decisions. You either progress or you don't; there's only one way to do it. Also, the environments weren't very interactive at all, reducing any immersiveness.
"To anyone who knew me better
Know I chose Saturn first 'cause it’s 2D heaven
Bernie Stolar dropped the ball with the RAM cartridge
X-men Vs. Street Fighter could’ve expanded the market"
-- Del | virtuadept
(frozen)
| | #136 posted November 18, 2007 at 6:57pm (EST) |
you're certainly entitled to your (wrong) opinion. 
| j_factor
| | #137 posted November 18, 2007 at 7:01pm (EST) |
virtuadept wrote:
> you're certainly entitled to your (wrong) opinion.
>
So do you NOT feel that Half-Life would've benefitted from more inventive level design, a less linear structure, and a higher level of interactivity in the environments?
"To anyone who knew me better
Know I chose Saturn first 'cause it’s 2D heaven
Bernie Stolar dropped the ball with the RAM cartridge
X-men Vs. Street Fighter could’ve expanded the market"
-- Del | Shadowchemist
 BTRs
(abandoned)
| | #138 posted November 18, 2007 at 7:11pm (EST) |
fudge.
you all suck | virtuadept
(frozen)
| | #139 posted November 18, 2007 at 7:19pm (EST) |
jesus fudge. any game would benefit from being better. that doesn't mean Half-Life wasn't incredible, esp. when it came out compared to previous titles.
| virtuadept
(frozen)
| #140 posted November 18, 2007 at 7:28pm (EST)
edited November 18, 2007 at 7:30pm (EST) |
well if you ask me LTTP and SOTN are not all that and a bag of chips, but I didn't play them when they came out, either. so it's all subjective depending on when YOU experienced the game.
also i wasn't slamming your score, that was Jeffro.
also you will never catch me disagreeing that Deus Ex is a better game than Half-Life.
| mentalpowers
| | #141 posted November 18, 2007 at 7:30pm (EST) |
virtuadept wrote:
> well if you ask me LTTP and SOTN are not all that and a bag of chips,
> but I didn't play them when they came out, either. so it's all subjective
> depending on when YOU experienced the game.
>
>
Likewise for me and Mario 64. Some games can overcome the age for at least some people though. I didn't play FFVII until maybe three years ago, but still enjoyed it.
Trade or sell me a Wavebird controller | sgtshaggy
| | #142 posted November 18, 2007 at 8:29pm (EST) |
j_factor wrote:
>I know it got a lot of glowing reviews, but when I played it, I didn't
> see how it was any better than System Shock 2.
Half-Life is in my top three FPS (Deus Ex, System Shock 2 and...Half-Life). I love all three.
Speaking of glowing reviews, this review pretty much encapsulates how I feel about the game (I completed it the day after it was released, on a "fast" new computer, so the timing and the new machine also affect my opinion).
Half-Life Review
It's a brilliant, important game, even if it's perceived as lackluster nowadays, IMO.
Interestingly enough, I've yet to come across an FPS as amazing as any of the three above, and they came out between 98 and 00. And the modding for Half-Life still has millions of people plugging in every day .
shags
| sgtshaggy
| | #143 posted November 18, 2007 at 8:31pm (EST) |
virtuadept wrote:
> well if you ask me LTTP and SOTN are not all that and a bag of chips,
> but I didn't play them when they came out, either. so it's all subjective
> depending on when YOU experienced the game.
Very true. We don't live in a vacuum. Our opinions are related to the medium as it is when we play the game. I've never bought into the idea that a classic has to be uber awesome 20 years later. Centipede is a classic, but most kids probably couldn't stand it nowadays. It's always fun to talk about what qualifies a game as a classic, though, but it's better saved for another thread  .
shags
| sgtshaggy
| | #144 posted November 18, 2007 at 9:45pm (EST) |
Anyway, risking a triple post, over an hour later:
Enemy Territory: Quake Wars - 10/10 - Just took over on the HD as the online shooter to play, a position held for some time by Battlefield 2. The maps are tight, the objectives fun, the classes varied and useful, the engine runs great, looks great, and the maps require teamwork and knowledge to complete, one helluva good online shooter.
| j_factor
| | #145 posted November 18, 2007 at 9:46pm (EST) |
*shrug* I have a 7 year old cousin who always wants to play my Genesis. His favorites (so far) are Shinobi 3, Gunstar Heroes, and Rocket Knight Adventures. These games are older than he is, and he loves them.
I've never bought the notion that games "age". It's either fun or it ain't.
"To anyone who knew me better
Know I chose Saturn first 'cause it’s 2D heaven
Bernie Stolar dropped the ball with the RAM cartridge
X-men Vs. Street Fighter could’ve expanded the market"
-- Del | Guru
| | #146 posted November 18, 2007 at 9:47pm (EST) |
Rocket Knight Adventures is the FUDGING CRAP now | sgtshaggy
| #147 posted November 18, 2007 at 9:50pm (EST)
edited November 18, 2007 at 9:54pm (EST) |
j_factor wrote:
> I've never bought the notion that games "age". It's either fun or
> it ain't.
I never said they do.
We do.
It's either fun, or it ain't, for you at the particular time you're playing it. Saying it's fun or it ain't is kinda like saying it's black, or it's white, and we both know things are never that simple (except in a very limited vacuum, like a brief period of time). Seven-year olds are more pure than a jaded teenager gamer with a crush on Halo. My daughter, who is eight, has grown up with 8-bit and 16-bit classics, but in 15 years, she may hate them, or look back on them fondly, who knows. They'll be the same games they were 10, 15, 20 years ago, of course they don't age...it's everything else that seems to throttle into the future. Kinda like one's mind, and one's body...but we don't need to go there...
shags
| Guru
| | #148 posted November 18, 2007 at 10:02pm (EST) |
Cid wrote:
> j_factor wrote:
>
>> I've never bought the notion that games "age". It's either fun or
>> it ain't.
>
> I never said they do.
>
> We do.
>
> It's either fun, or it ain't, for you at the particular time you're playing
> it. Saying it's fun or it ain't is kinda like saying it's black, or it's white,
> and we both know things are never that simple (except in a very limited vacuum,
> like a brief period of time). Seven-year olds are more pure than a jaded teenager
> gamer with a crush on Halo. My daughter, who is eight, has grown up with 8-bit
> and 16-bit classics, but in 15 years, she may hate them, or look back on them
> fondly, who knows. They'll be the same games they were 10, 15, 20 years ago,
> of course they don't age...it's everything else that seems to throttle into
> the future. Kinda like one's mind, and one's body...but we don't need to go
> there...
>
> shags
>
>
We are talking about that in the Galaxy thread.  | AlphakirA
(frozen)
| | #149 posted November 18, 2007 at 10:09pm (EST) |
I think the only games that don't 'are' well are usually games based specifically of what the graphics 'could do' back when the game came out. If the game was simply a masterpiece only because of how it looked, of course it's not going to age well. RPGs are a prime example of this. The majority of RPGs aren't graphically based and storyline/strategy driven, thus most age excellently and are usually the most sought after genre 10+ years after release.
 | sgtshaggy
| | #150 posted November 18, 2007 at 10:20pm (EST) |
Guru wrote:
> We are talking about that in the Galaxy thread.
Yeah, this is well-traveled territory, lol.
shags
| virtuadept
(frozen)
| | #151 posted November 18, 2007 at 10:35pm (EST) |
i agree with everything Shags writes. i think we were twins separated at birth.
| Guru
| | #152 posted November 18, 2007 at 10:37pm (EST) |
He can be the cool twin that teaches you how to dance and appreciate life again. | virtuadept
(frozen)
| | #153 posted November 18, 2007 at 10:38pm (EST) |
 
i do not look like Danny Divito
| vDub
 
| | #154 posted November 18, 2007 at 10:41pm (EST) |
Admiral wrote:
> I'm adjusting my Half Life score. I had it at 7/10, well now it's
> a 6/10.
>
> The last couple of levels are just plain awful. Way too much jumping
> and falling. That and the ending sucks huge balls. You get two choices,
> and both lead to....
>
> THE CREDITS.
>
> LAME AS HELL.
>
> I could recommend about 10 different FPS's of THAT ERA I'd rather
> play. This game starts off SO good, but the quality drops off fast
> once it hits the middle. Plus, with the mine cart riding, jumping
> levels, bad ending, and to be honest - LACK OF STORY, this is just
> plain average.
>
> I really still wanna play HL2 though, cause it looks great and gets
> great reviews. I'm more skeptical now though.
I'm surprised Jeffro just didn't bend you over and rape your ass for that. Compared to when I gave my weak-scored review of Half-Life, his reaction was pretty tame.
 | Guru
| | #155 posted November 18, 2007 at 10:43pm (EST) |
virtuadept wrote:
>
>
> i do not look like Danny Divito
>
Whoa! I knew I got that from a movie or something. Title plz? | virtuadept
(frozen)
| | #156 posted November 18, 2007 at 10:50pm (EST) |
Twins i think was the name of it. had arnold and danny.
| sgtshaggy
| | #157 posted November 18, 2007 at 11:00pm (EST) |
virtuadept wrote:
> i do not look like Danny Divito
I certainly don't look like Ahnold .
shags
| Jeffro
| | #158 posted November 18, 2007 at 11:09pm (EST) |
vDub wrote:
> Admiral wrote:
>> I'm adjusting my Half Life score. I had it at 7/10,
> well now it's
>> a 6/10.
>>
>> The last couple of levels are just plain awful.
> Way too much jumping
>> and falling. That and the ending sucks huge balls.
> You get two choices,
>> and both lead to....
>>
>> THE CREDITS.
>>
>> LAME AS HELL.
>>
>> I could recommend about 10 different FPS's of THAT
> ERA I'd rather
>> play. This game starts off SO good, but the quality
> drops off fast
>> once it hits the middle. Plus, with the mine cart
> riding, jumping
>> levels, bad ending, and to be honest - LACK OF
> STORY, this is just
>> plain average.
>>
>> I really still wanna play HL2 though, cause it looks
> great and gets
>> great reviews. I'm more skeptical now though.
>
> I'm surprised Jeffro just didn't bend you over and
> rape your ass for that. Compared to when I gave my
> weak-scored review of Half-Life, his reaction was pretty
> tame.
>
>
I have had an average blood pressure of 140 over 100 for the last week and a half, I cant afford to let stupidity in this thread anger me so.
YOUR SUCH A SUPER LADY!! | vDub
| | #159 posted November 18, 2007 at 11:11pm (EST) |
I guess you need to get away from the site for a long, long time then. If you never come back, even better. 
| Jeffro
| | #160 posted November 19, 2007 at 1:25am (EST) |
If it was the site causing it I'd just go ahead and die, cuz I"m fudging addicted to this damn place.
YOUR SUCH A SUPER LADY!! | | |
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