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Topic   chatting Official Discussion Thread - For Discussion of the Steals Thread Only

Lunar
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* 21-Mar(#1)
Want to discuss about @Jeff's awesome steals thread but don't want to interrupt the flow? Feel free to discuss anything about the thread here.

Let's go. Feel free to rip someone a new one here.

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NatGasHole
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21-Mar(#2)
Great idea. You all suck butts.

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Lunar
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21-Mar(#3)
Butts are made for sucking...wait, was that an auto correct?

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Rune_Walsh
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21-Mar(#4)
Lunar is a bum comparable to Prime/Trump! 😀


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whitefire
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21-Mar(#5)
Great idea. Can you start off with "Discussion Thread" though? It may help avoid accidentally posting in the wrong thread.



Please take a look at my auction https://m.gametz.com/Console_Marketplace/whitefire...
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NatGasHole
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21-Mar(#6)
Considering the stick of truth. Saw it got great reviews when it was released. Only bad thing is I don't have much to offer anymore. What are thoughts on allowing someone to borrow a game from me for a month? For example I have Nioh on PS4. I ship it to person and they can borrow it for up to one month then when they're finished or their month is up they send back to me. Thoughts on this? Is it stupid?

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Lunar
GameTZ Gold Subscriber 800 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader
21-Mar(#7)
Nah, borrowing just leads to an opportunity to scams.

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RobotVendingMachine
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21-Mar(#8)
It might be time to bring the virtual box.

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Lunar
GameTZ Gold Subscriber 800 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader
21-Mar(#9)
lol, the thread is reminding me of the end of the Virtual Box actually...though we keep getting Phoenix Down thrown on it.

Which is a good and a bad thing.

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Lunar
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21-Mar(#10)
Rune_Walsh wrote:
> Lunar is a bum comparable to Prime/Trump! 😀
>

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Lunar
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* 21-Mar(#11)
One way I thought to moderate people dib and run is to attach the amount of discount for the item you are offering. this way people can clearly see how much you took and how much you are offering, though value can be subjective and can have a range

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RobotVendingMachine
GameTZ Subscriber Double Gold Good Trader
21-Mar(#12)
average price from ebay and amazon. have a google doc.

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Lunar
GameTZ Gold Subscriber 800 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader
21-Mar(#13)
hmm, maybe just use a site like pricechart or gamevaluenow?

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RobotVendingMachine
GameTZ Subscriber Double Gold Good Trader
21-Mar(#14)
yea maybe so. example:

Steal 1:
TMNT 2 arcade-CIB-VGPC $35.50- Steal Price $10.00

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whitefire
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21-Mar(#15)
I'm on the prowl this time around. I've got a few steals all ready to go. Wii U, PS4, and XB1. Give me something good, Groo.



Please take a look at my auction https://m.gametz.com/Console_Marketplace/whitefire...
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RobotVendingMachine
GameTZ Subscriber Double Gold Good Trader
21-Mar(#16)
The issue I see is on consoles. Ebay prices are the only current option. You then have to try and match quality for quality and the lowest BIN price.

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Lunar
GameTZ Gold Subscriber 800 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader
21-Mar(#17)
RVM's deal is decent if you want a Steam Link, not sure why Steam Link isn't as popular as it should be. I own one just to have the option of mirroring my PC, playing Steam games on my big screen is a nice perk.

Also, that random Famicom game is good though, its appeal is prob limited to a select few considering the types(more modern based) of people we get in that thread.

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tonymack21
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21-Mar(#18)
RobotVendingMachine wrote:
> It might be time to bring the virtual box.
>
>

I was thinking the same, there have been a lot of quality games since the holidays, it kind of died back before the holidays and I was thinking about this time might be a good time to bring it back around now that people have played a lot of the games and may have some stuff available again that would be in demand.

what do you think @dashey ?


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NatGasHole
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21-Mar(#19)
I don't know what the virtual box is.I'm guessing you share games with each other? I'd be interested.

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Dashey
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21-Mar(#20)
If there's enough interests, I guess I can bring it back. We can start off from the last virtual box as to whose turn it is as well.

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cblake78
250 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
21-Mar(#21)
Kicking myself for not taking that 2DS steal...almost took your DS Lite Lunar but really wanna be able to play 3DS games. Current steals are ok...question -- do I have to have the Steam game downloaded on my Mac/PC to play using Steam Link?
NatGasHole
GameTZ Subscriber Double Gold Good Trader
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21-Mar(#22)
Do people care at all about blu ray movies anymore?

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cblake78
250 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
21-Mar(#23)
NatGasHole wrote:
> Do people care at all about blu ray movies anymore?
>
>

Apparently not. I had to give mine away in that thread for them to be considered a steal.
whitefire
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21-Mar(#24)
NatGasHole wrote:
> Do people care at all about blu ray movies anymore?
>
>

Only cinephiles/ collectors for the most part and people who don't know about digital or are scared of it.



Please take a look at my auction https://m.gametz.com/Console_Marketplace/whitefire...
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Jeff
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21-Mar(#25)

I like apple pie, its delicious.



Jeff
NatGasHole
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21-Mar(#26)
Hot apple pie with vanilla ice cream. Lieutenant Dan.... Ice cream!

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Gypsy
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21-Mar(#27)
whitefire wrote:
> NatGasHole wrote:
>> Do people care at all about blu ray movies anymore?
>>
>>
>
> Only cinephiles/ collectors for the most part and people who don't know about digital
> or are scared of it.
>
>

There is another group with digital, people with poor internet connections. I was finally able to upgrade my internet at home awhile back to get away from horrifically capped satellite internet but I still couldn't even come close to streaming HD content at non-peak times.

I also just fall into the collector group as well though.
Gypsy
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21-Mar(#28)
Oh and FUDGE YEAH PIE.
Lunar
GameTZ Gold Subscriber 800 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader
21-Mar(#29)
I'm in the half and half camp. I have some blus(mostly kids animated and Ghibli), theyre just not worth selling at the trending prices.

I also a bunch of blus at $2-$3 through auctions on here.

I have a decent digital library, but stopped acquiring actively since people are asking for $6 for a new release now? Ridic!

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tonymack21
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21-Mar(#30)
Angus_McFife wrote:
> Oh and FUDGE YEAH PIE.

That's right fudge ya...pie is the surpreme...I always request pie over cake.


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Jeff
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22-Mar(#31)
I'll be shutting down the thread today and running it on a monthly basis.



Jeff
cblake78
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22-Mar(#32)
Probably a good call.
Gypsy
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22-Mar(#33)
Running it in bursts seems like a good idea. Running it constantly will run everyone out of trade-able stuff.
Jeff
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22-Mar(#34)
I'll be giving it a break for a bit before I update the rules. It'll give me a bit of time to work out the kinks... some things to address:

1.) free stuff (can be thrown in, but cannot be in the equation of a "steal" offering)
2.) mystery boxes
3.) steal value minimums (must be at least X dollar amount)
4.) steal tiers (ill explain this when i revise the thread... no more high value items for junk in return)

anything else I may have missed?



Jeff
Lunar
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22-Mar(#35)
Agreed. A break is a good idea.

We still want to see what @KingofGames receive from those two mystery boxes. Anyone want to take a stab at guessing?

I believe they were a N64 and a Genesis bundle.

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Jeff
GameTZ Subscriber 450 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader
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22-Mar(#36)
he can post the contents here



Jeff
cblake78
250 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
22-Mar(#37)
Jeff wrote:
> I'll be giving it a break for a bit before I update the rules. It'll give me a bit
> of time to work out the kinks... some things to address:
>
> 1.) free stuff (can be thrown in, but cannot be in the equation of a "steal" offering)
> 2.) mystery boxes
> 3.) steal value minimums (must be at least X dollar amount)
> 4.) steal tiers (ill explain this when i revise the thread... no more high value
> items for junk in return)
>
> anything else I may have missed?
>
>

Steal tiers would be interesting and probably needed...maybe 4-5 levels ($1-10 discount, $11-20 discount, $21-30 discount, $31-40 discount, $41-50 discount)?

If you claim something within tier 3 let's say ($21-30 discount), you must post something as a steal in that same tier or higher.
Lunar
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22-Mar(#38)
I just wish people would be honest and reciprocate appropriately. It was simple and easy and fun.

Obviously, some restrictions needed to be in place to make sure people don't take advantage, but really makes the process more complicated than it should be.

If only people are honest...

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Lunar
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22-Mar(#39)
This really reminds me of the retro virtual box, tiers really killed it at the end.

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Jeff
GameTZ Subscriber 450 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader
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22-Mar(#40)
Lunar wrote:
> I just wish people would be honest and reciprocate appropriately. It was simple and
> easy and fun.
>
> Obviously, some restrictions needed to be in place to make sure people don't take
> advantage, but really makes the process more complicated than it should be.
>
> If only people are honest...

Of course, but if there's no real repercussions (will i get restricted/banned for this?) then it's all free reign...

so, with that being said, whoever got their hands in the pot before won't be able to do it again.



Jeff
Jeff
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22-Mar(#41)
Lunar wrote:
> This really reminds me of the retro virtual box, tiers really killed it at the end.

It won't be as complicated. I promise that.



Jeff
cblake78
250 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
* 22-Mar(#42)
Jeff wrote:
> Lunar wrote:
>> I just wish people would be honest and reciprocate appropriately. It was simple
> and
>> easy and fun.
>>
>> Obviously, some restrictions needed to be in place to make sure people don't take
>> advantage, but really makes the process more complicated than it should be.
>>
>> If only people are honest...
>
> Of course, but if there's no real repercussions (will i get restricted/banned for
> this?) then it's all free reign...
>
> so, with that being said, whoever got their hands in the pot before won't be able
> to do it again.
>
>

I feel like most people were fair about it...I know I for one didn't always have the most desirable stuff but I always tried to make sure my steals offered made up for what I had dibbed. I relied on the feedback and if my items weren't moving I altered them as much as I could to make sure they were worth people's dibs.

I feel like most people have done that...until the end when it seemed like people offered up whatever and were fine with their dib reverting.
Lunar
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* 22-Mar(#43)
I think what people didn't understand is the concept of reciprocation. There were alot of attention and focus on individual deals.

Why was $10 PSN for $3 a good steal in the beginning? Because that's the amount of discount we were operating at.

But if you take a Pokemon Sun/Moon Dual Pack Sealed for $10 shipped, then offered $30 PSN for $10(while this is a GREAT steal on its own), but in this case it's called stealing because the guy pocketed $30+.

Or a more recent example, you take a sealed Pokemon Omega/Alpha and give back a DualShock 2 controller wry smile

You have to see this as a trade, like I am getting a $60-$70 discount on this game, therefore, what can I offer so it will have a similar amount of discount.

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cblake78
250 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
22-Mar(#44)
Lunar wrote:
> I think what people didn't understand is the concept of reciprocation. There were
> alot of attention and focus on individual deals.
>
> Why was $10 PSN for $3 a good steal in the beginning? Because that's the amount of
> discount we were operating at.
>
> But if you take a Pokemon Sun/Moon Dual Pack Sealed for $10 shipped, then offered
> $30 PSN for $10(while this is a GREAT steal on its own), but in this case it's called
> stealing because the guy pocketed $30+.
>
> Or a more recent example, you take a sealed Pokemon Omega/Alpha and give back a DualShock
> 2 controller wry smile
>
> You have to see this as a trade, like I am getting a $60-$70 discount on this game,
> therefore, what can I offer so it will have a similar amount of discount.
>
>

Yeah, that's not reciprocating at all. Did that actually happen? I know I dibbed that $30 PSN for $10 but didn't pay attention to what came before.
Lunar
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22-Mar(#45)
cblake78 wrote:
> Yeah, that's not reciprocating at all. Did that actually happen? I know I dibbed
> that $30 PSN for $10 but didn't pay attention to what came before.

True story, this happened in the thread and was what got me TRIGGERED

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DarkLink
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* 22-Mar(#46)
Just wanted to say thanks to the 3 that I called dibs on their items..

Thanks guys -
@The_Pope
@KingofGames
@Dashey



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Jeff
GameTZ Subscriber 450 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader
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22-Mar(#47)
What's done is done, we can only work to make the thread better :)



Jeff
tonymack21
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* 22-Mar(#48)
Lunar wrote:
>
> True story, this happened in the thread and was what got me TRIGGERED
>
>

Oh man you got me lol'ing on that..not sure why I thought your caps usage was so funny there I guess it's early and my brain isn't fully engaged yet today.


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Gypsy
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22-Mar(#49)
A few comments...

Free stuff is fine, but it depends on the value. If it's free junk I agree that shouldn't constitute a steal by itself but a free $30 item should be totally fine. It's all about the amount off of the real value. While this can be a bit fussy on some items, I think it's generally pretty easy to determine based on sold listings and what is available to buy.

As for mystery boxes, I think they are fine to offer. But then that user has to prove themself. Like Pope's boxes were awesome. I'm betting a box from Whitefire would be pretty great. However if you send a crap box ( like say this completely random example: some handhelds for about full market price), then you start to lose trust. I think @Jeff vetting mystery boxes is a good idea, but maybe get the input of some others as well. Of course these people would have to be willing to not claim the boxes. I'd be down for it.

A value minimum is a great idea. I wouldn't want to discourage thread participation, but I think it should be $20.

Tiers could get messy I wouldn't recommend that. Like with @cblake78's idea it sounds nice but then if you have to stay in the same tier or higher it can never go back down. Like @Lunar said it's all about HONESTY. You don't have to lose money in the thread, but at least try to keep it fairly even with what you are taking. Personally, if I post another big steal in the future I will reserve the right to determine if the follow-up steal is good enough. I think that's completely fair if I'm going to offer a $50+ discount on something.
Gypsy
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22-Mar(#50)
Basically I said a lot of crap but it all goes back to being honest.
The_Pope
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22-Mar(#51)
I think this all sounds good on paper but requiring the dollar amounts to be even across the board is not sustainable. This is either going to bottom out after the first or second high value steal or it's going to be the same two or three people. People should just post stuff they'd like to get themselves and if they don't, the stuff won't be taken and they'll lose the steal. It's not up to one or two people decide what constitutes a good deal. People doged about one of Dashey's steals that I was thrilled to dib.
Dashey
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22-Mar(#52)
DarkLink wrote:
> Just wanted to say thanks to the 3 that I called dibs on their items..
>
> Thanks guys -
> @The_Pope
> @KingofGames
> @Dashey
>
>

No problem. Enjoy Breath of the Wild!


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Lunar
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22-Mar(#53)
Doesn't have to be an exact even exchange in value, I expect a steady decline of discounted value over at least a few steals. Too many times thing go from $50 discount to $20, then to bottom in 2 dibs. Way too fast IMO

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DefaultGen
GameTZ Gold Subscriber Triple Gold Good Trader
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22-Mar(#54)
Oh man are we talking tiers? This is like the Retro Virtual Box except people are arbitrarily exchanging cash too smile I think encouraging people to put in what they take out is ideal over turning it into a rigid structure of rating how worthwhile your deal is sort of thing.

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whitefire
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* 22-Mar(#55)
Trying to dictate value never works. Trust me. Just ask Lunar and me. We've went over and over trying to come up with a feasible solution. It just doesn't work.



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Gypsy
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22-Mar(#56)
The_Pope wrote:
> I think this all sounds good on paper but requiring the dollar amounts to be even
> across the board is not sustainable.

Right that's the huge issue with it. It just can't work because then the value could never go down. It's a judgement call/within reason kind of thing.
Rune_Walsh
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22-Mar(#57)
I agree, it's gotta be reasonable, if you take something worth $100 at a $50 price, don't throw up some junk for free to make up for it when it's your turn and you're up.


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Lunar
GameTZ Gold Subscriber 800 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader
22-Mar(#58)
Agreed on the reasonable exchange. I just think the rolling down the hill needs to be slowed. If someone takes a hit and put up a $50 discounted item, then at least offer a $40-$50 discount item back. I think a $10 range is pretty good. It's tough to really judge these values though.

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Lunar
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* 22-Mar(#59)
whitefire wrote:
> Trying to dictate value never works. Trust me. Just ask Lunar and me. We've went
> over and over trying to come up with a feasible solution. It just doesn't work.
>

Indeed, many different ideas were tried and (mostly)failed. All the Virtual Boxes etc and including the steals thread, seemed to work the best in the beginning.
When people start hearing/seeing the goodies, then the riff-raff bunch shows up and ruins the fun.
And then the host comes in to put some restrictions and down goes the simple and fun run. Sad!

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Jeff
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22-Mar(#60)
As long as everyone is on board, it will work... I tried to put the least amount of restrictions as possible (on the steals themselves...), im going to sleep on it for a few days and see what I can think up. I love the concept and I'm willing to put some time into it.



Jeff
tonymack21
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22-Mar(#61)
Agreed I think the concept ia really good, it's just that anything has a finite shelf life I guess? Virtual boxes have a good run and die down, so I suppose it is here too. Doing it once a month or something seems good possibly allows people to rebuild their stock of items they are willing to offer or finish a couple games they would be willing to part with etc.

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NatGasHole
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22-Mar(#62)
If a persons item doesn't get dibbed the punishment should be more than a 48 hour ban. Maybe that would help? Maybe the next time around they're banned until the next time the thread opens up?

Not your typical oilman
cblake78
250 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
22-Mar(#63)
NatGasHole wrote:
> If a persons item doesn't get dibbed the punishment should be more than a 48 hour
> ban. Maybe that would help? Maybe the next time around they're banned until the next
> time the thread opens up?
>
>

I don't think that was ever enforced. Several items went unclaimed it seemed with no repercussions.
NatGasHole
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22-Mar(#64)
True. We need it to be enforced then. I would have gotten banned there at the end but then the thread was closed.

Not your typical oilman
Jeff
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22-Mar(#65)
the issue is people stopped caring if their items weren't taken. I agree, there will be repercussions this time around. there will be no more free items to hand out to "solidify your steal goes through"...

we will see what happens, I have a few ideas.


Jeff
Wchillinman
Silver Good Trader
22-Mar(#66)
NatGasHole wrote:
> If a persons item doesn't get dibbed the punishment should be more than a 48 hour
> ban. Maybe that would help? Maybe the next time around they're banned until the next
> time the thread opens up?
>
>
As someone that has been watching from the sidelines, this doesn't seem like a good idea. I've watched multiple times an item steal go back or almost go back to the previous steal even though the steal was good. Sometimes I've even watched as some people were even counting down the time for the previous steal to return (and/or trying to early dib the previous) because they had no interest in the current steals but had interest in the previous.

It really depends on who is online at the time as well. There was times where someone that was interested in the item(s) of the current steal was offline at the time or just missed the cutoff. If you ban the other person for however long or especially until the next time, you may have just unknowingly took multiple people out of the current tread because those people just happened to have what each other wanted and was not interested in what others have to offer. Which in turn may stale the current tread at the time. I know that's maybe a bit of an extreme case but it is still possible.
pr0phet
GameTZ Subscriber Triple Gold Good Trader
22-Mar(#67)
Idea for next run.

To get a steal, you vote on the next steal. Most plus votes gets it.
Pros
Gets more people involved. Steals don't last 1-2 minutes.
Forces better steals. Can't offer low value for high value.

Cons
May eliminate people. Not everybody has high dollar items for cheap.
Slows down the thread. I did see some people who liked steals every 5 minutes.
Lunar
GameTZ Gold Subscriber 800 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader
* 22-Mar(#68)
We did do that once. I thought it was a pretty positive experience. But it could exclude people, and also some people(prob not even a participant) could just neg because they don't like the person or have a miserable life)

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whitefire
GameTZ Subscriber 500 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader
Global Trader - willing to trade internationally This user is on the site NOW (37 seconds ago)
22-Mar(#69)
Lunar wrote:
> We did do that once. I thought it was a pretty positive experience. But it could
> exclude people, and also some people(prob not even a participant) could just neg
> because they don't like the person or have a miserable life)
>
>

I think he means + votes only.



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Foxhack
GameTZ Subscriber 250 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader
Gold Global Trader (7) This user is on the site NOW (7 minutes ago)
* 22-Mar(#70)
I saw the thread but I'm not sure I have anything worth offering as a steal. I would KILL LOVE to get my hands on that Kid Dracula cart, though.
pr0phet
GameTZ Subscriber Triple Gold Good Trader
22-Mar(#71)
whitefire wrote:
> Lunar wrote:
>> We did do that once. I thought it was a pretty positive experience. But it could
>> exclude people, and also some people(prob not even a participant) could just neg
>> because they don't like the person or have a miserable life)
>>
>>
>
> I think he means + votes only.
>
>

Yeah, it would be + votes only
FrictionPin
Silver Good Trader
(frozen)
* 22-Mar(#72)
One of the biggest problems I saw with the steals in general is the constant misunderstand in price of the item vs discount off the item value. If I offer a $50 item for $10, that's a $40 steal value and the next offer is a $30 item for $10 as that's a $20 steal value. This is NOT okay, that means someone is taking $40 and giving $20, plain and simple. This is how we get to $10 items for free within 2 steals and it happened a lot.

I would certainly like to see the steals follow the value instead of item price. Certainly once this goes up, it would be difficult to sustain so maybe employ a 10% variance in the next steal. Using the example above, if I posted a $40 steal value, the next steal would need to have a steal value of $36-$44 (not an item value of this price, but a steal value). Using this method gives us the ability to go up in value and down but on a slower pace, thus giving the ability to "pay it forward" and stop the abuse of the system. Obviously there are still ways to work the system, especially at the lower values but it might help balance things out and find our sweet spot in which the most people can participate.
tonymack21
GameTZ Subscriber 350 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader
Has Written 3 Reviews
* 22-Mar(#73)
Hmm that's not bad friction. I think it may have been @Lunar who said at some point think of it as a trade where the values need to be close, if you're saving 30 on your deal you need to offer about 30 worth of savings. This could fall in line with that line of thinking

It may be relative to what the person offering is truly giving up as well. A few pstv's went in the thread and while they sell for a lot more than what we got them for several of these were probably bought when walmart was giving them away for 20 dollars..so the person offering may not always be taking a hit? It will be hard to come up with a perfect system that works in every instance but a rough percentage may not be out of the question


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tigg
Silver Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
22-Mar(#74)
did the steal thread end?
NatGasHole
GameTZ Subscriber Double Gold Good Trader
Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
22-Mar(#75)
tigg wrote:
> did the steal thread end?

Temporarily

Not your typical oilman
tigg
Silver Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
22-Mar(#76)
I loved the steal thread got a lot of great deal from a lot of people. Only problem i ran into is that I dont have the highly sought after stuff people wanted so I felt out of place.
NatGasHole
GameTZ Subscriber Double Gold Good Trader
Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
22-Mar(#77)
I'm going to become a garage sale psycho because of this thread. Any garage sale with any kind of gaming stuff is going to be visited.

Not your typical oilman
GeeWiz
Quadruple Gold Good Trader
* 23-Mar(#78)
The whole value thing was the reason I barely dibbed (besides my first time) because the things I wanted to offer weren't high value items compared to many of the steals posted. That's why I only dibbed on low value items (which was 3 times; 2x Pokemon games for $10, Infinite Warfare for $8, and a free copy of OoT 3D)
Lunar
GameTZ Gold Subscriber 800 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader
23-Mar(#79)
GeeWiz wrote:
> The whole value thing was the reason I barely dibbed (besides my first time) because
> the things I wanted to offer weren't high value items compared to many of the steals
> posted. That's why I only dibbed on low value items.

Which is exactly how its supposed to work. You SHOULD hesitate before taking a good deal. Unless you have a good deal ready to roll.
Else everything would be dibbed immediately(which happened for a good while), until people got tired of seeing the same options that
nobody picked.


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GeeWiz
Quadruple Gold Good Trader
23-Mar(#80)
Which ultimately killed the thread for the time being. The giant list of options was good in the beginning but in the end, it just slowed things down since most of them were filled with things no one wanted/cared about.

All the requests people were making, while being criticized, helped the thread move along since people knew what to post and knew it would be dibbed in a snap by at least one person.

And the whole eCurrency thing was bad from the beginning since it didn't stop some from dibbing on sought after items, most of which were high dollar to some degree, and just list the currency with little to no loss at all. That should be brought up in the next thread.

Topic   chatting Official Discussion Thread - For Discussion of the Steals Thread Only