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| Author | Message |
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benstylus
  
 
| | #1 posted May 6, 2008 at 9:05am (EDT) |
I remember a while ago jonathonwillie got a btr which, to me, seemed to be more of a misunderstanding rather than him intentionally scamming the guy.
And I recall you mentioning a while back that you'd have to ban him if he didn't get it resolved (which he didn't, and he has been banned for months).
Why then, are users like Brad still roaming free here, when not only has he made no effort to clean up his BTRs, but when asked to fix them, has on many occasions laughed it off or refused in one way or another?
FIX YOUR BTRS!
"I can't, I'm so fat I've become house ridden in my basement and all of my out going parcels were swallowed by my massive fat glands."
ARE YOU EVER GOING TO FIX YOUR BTRS?
"No, I want 4 more so every time I post something 5 people can go "wow you have 7 BTR's""
3 BTR'S?
"I ate a baby and pissed on a cross too."
I don't know if there was some other reason you had for banning JW (I know he's canadian, but we don't hold that against _kate_), but he was a far more conscientious forum poster as well as trader (looking at brad's forum posts, I don't think there's been a single constructive one since he got his btrs).
So how do you determine whether to ban someone for a BTR or to let them roam?
You're arguing for a universe with fewer waffles in it.
I'm prepared to call that cowardice. |
bill
  
 
| #2 posted May 6, 2008 at 9:49am (EDT)
edited May 6, 2008 at 9:57am (EDT) |
Basically, I was just waiting for the community to demand that Brad be banned...
Really, I hadn't taken much notice of him until just this morning when I saw him post and saw the BTRs (which I'd seen before, but now a lot of time has gone by). And, I had the same reaction: "Why haven't I banned him?"
So, is anyone against me banning Brad? I really can't see much reason not to kick him off the site.
A side note: I see questions like this raised from time to time, "why haven't you..." based on some existing condition on the site. And, my answer is usually, because I just hadn't noticed that condition yet. I'm really not so different from most people on the site. I miss stuff. There's a lot going on and there's only so much I can do. Really, the noob_pendings forum is a good example. It's a fire-hose of information and just too much to deal with, even with lots of people reading that forum, it's overwhelming. So, there's only so much I can do. Basically, I rely heavily on people reporting issue to me so that they can be acted on. You've done that now, and that's good. But, I think I'd prefer you made this topic not a general "when do you..." style thing, but a specific, "It's time to ban Brad". Not a big deal, but just something that I noticed happens sometimes (not just you). I think there can be an expectation that I know everything that's going on and thus if someone hasn't been done it's because I've chosen not to act. But, this isn't always the case. |
invisibleink
| | #3 posted May 6, 2008 at 9:53am (EDT) |
i would say if you banned him he would be even less likely to make the BTR's right but they are all from last year so it doesnt look like he plans on doing anything about them other than saying childish, stupid stuff in the forums |
Iced
| | #4 posted May 6, 2008 at 9:58am (EDT) |
Normally I'd say don't do it because he's a subscriber and he's quite funny.
But since he's actually neither... |
mmm40x
 
| | #5 posted May 6, 2008 at 10:01am (EDT) |
bill wrote:
But, I
> think I'd prefer you made this topic not a general
> "when do you..." style thing, but a specific, "It's
> time to ban Brad". Not a big deal, but just something
> that I noticed happens sometimes (not just you). I
> think there can be an expectation that I know everything
> that's going on and thus if someone hasn't been done
> it's because I've chosen not to act.
I think the reason people ( some, not all) don't do more of this is because you are the owner. This is your site. It's more out of respect for that than our expectation that you know and must take care of everything. |
Iced
| | #6 posted May 6, 2008 at 10:15am (EDT) |
bill, have you ever thought of making BTR notifications even more humiliating? Like, maybe taking over their current forum avatar with "I AM A BAD TRADER AND SHOULD BE IGNORED UNTIL I CLEAR UP MY BTRS" in big, red letters against a white background? Maybe even stamping that in their bio info too? Or wherever possible? It just seems like certain users (such as Brad) aren't even phased by the fact that they have multiple BTRs. |
bill
| | #7 posted May 6, 2008 at 10:28am (EDT) |
I get the impression that Brad just doesn't care. In that case, there isn't much to do besides ban him. |
benstylus
| | #8 posted May 6, 2008 at 10:30am (EDT) |
well, the purpose of this thread wasn't necessarily to ban brad... but to consider unbanning jonathonwillie if you weren't going to ban brad.
Need a small short-term loan?
Ask benstylus. |
MightySlacker
 
| | #9 posted May 6, 2008 at 10:31am (EDT) |
I agree wholeheartedly.
Dave
2004-07-22 17:30:17 Morph Mr. Funny man, get ready to have ur life get funnier
HAS HE LEARNED ANYTHING IN A YEAR?
7-Sep-2005 11:04pm Morph keep it up mighty i will have you nailed for harassment
HELL NO! |
MightySlacker
| | #10 posted May 6, 2008 at 10:31am (EDT) |
benstylus wrote:
> I don't know if there was some other reason you had for banning JW
> (I know he's canadian, but we don't hold that against _kate_)
We don't?
Dave
2004-07-22 17:30:17 Morph Mr. Funny man, get ready to have ur life get funnier
HAS HE LEARNED ANYTHING IN A YEAR?
7-Sep-2005 11:04pm Morph keep it up mighty i will have you nailed for harassment
HELL NO! |
PariahComplex
| | #11 posted May 6, 2008 at 10:32am (EDT) |
have trading completely disabled if a btr exists? |
benstylus
| #12 posted May 6, 2008 at 10:51am (EDT)
edited May 6, 2008 at 10:54am (EDT) |
MightySlacker wrote:
> benstylus wrote:
>
>> I don't know if there was some other reason you had for banning
> JW
>> (I know he's canadian, but we don't hold that against _kate_)
>
> We don't?
>
I don't think we do - but it could just be that she has a vagina. And those eyes....
Need a small short-term loan?
Ask benstylus. |
bill
| #13 posted May 6, 2008 at 10:56am (EDT)
edited May 6, 2008 at 10:56am (EDT) |
I don't really know what happened with jonathonwillie ... he said he'd send the PSP back, but then he evaporated (didn't respond to emails)... does he even want to come back? |
benstylus
| | #14 posted May 6, 2008 at 10:57am (EDT) |
i don't know - i'll find out even if i have to go to canada myself.
If he does, will you unban him? 
Need a small short-term loan?
Ask benstylus. |
bill
| | #15 posted May 6, 2008 at 11:01am (EDT) |
why do you care? |
benstylus
| #16 posted May 6, 2008 at 11:05am (EDT)
edited May 6, 2008 at 11:06am (EDT) |
because he's carrying my baby?
I don't really know what kind of answer you're looking for - I just never really felt right about him being banned in the first place, and seeing brad walking around with his proverbial cock hanging out just reminds me of how much better jonathonwillie was.
I guess I just don't believe jonathonwillie is a bad trader - he just happened upon a bad situation with a relatively new (at the time) trader. Plus, reading the BTR I still can't figure out exactly what wallyemaster sent and what he wants back...
Need a small short-term loan?
Ask benstylus. |
BoB
 
| | #17 posted May 6, 2008 at 11:20am (EDT) |
jw is on msn all the time i can talk to him if you want and see what he thinks.
i havent been fudgeed like that since grade school - marla |
bill
| #18 posted May 6, 2008 at 11:21am (EDT)
edited May 6, 2008 at 11:22am (EDT) |
wallyemaster sent a psp, but jonathonwillie wasn't happy with it... so jonathonwillie agreed to send it back to resolve the BTR... then I heard nothing more. There was more in the middle that I'm skipping, basically the reason the BTR went up (jonathonwillie just held it for a while, making wallyemaster wait).
jonathonwillie didn't have the best reputation... 2 resolved BTRs under his belt... suspeded for racist remarks once... a couple pages of complaints, 2 restrictions... I see a recent case where he tried to do a retaliation rating (which was related to a trade where jonathonwillie made the other guy wait for weeks)...
He may seem good compared to Brad, but that doesn't make him a good trader.
Though, I did tell jonathonwillie that I'd let him back if he resolved the wallyemaster BTR. I'd honor that. |
Grenadier
| | #19 posted May 6, 2008 at 11:28am (EDT) |
Banhammer both of 'em!
Click here to join Goozex and get a free game! |
invisibleink
| | #20 posted May 6, 2008 at 11:41am (EDT) |
banhammer us all and let ceiling cat sort us out |
darktangerine
| | #21 posted May 6, 2008 at 11:54am (EDT) |
Speaking of BTRs, what about Crazyeights? He's logged in a couple times since screwing people out of around $400 back last summer(& I was nearly one of his victims) and not even given them a response. |
bill
| | #22 posted May 6, 2008 at 12:28pm (EDT) |
I suspended Brad and I changed Crazyeights status from frozen to "bad trader". |
gameplayer9
| | #23 posted May 6, 2008 at 2:50pm (EDT) |
ban everyone,,,,and me |
BoB
| | #24 posted May 6, 2008 at 3:25pm (EDT) |
could we do a trial of this idea?start with koray if it works out then hell yeah mass ban.
i havent been fudgeed like that since grade school - marla |
invisibleink
| #25 posted May 6, 2008 at 5:41pm (EDT)
edited May 6, 2008 at 5:41pm (EDT) |
why did koko-ray edit his screen name from being shown. i think thats a pretty shady move!! ban koko-ray |
BrotherJohn0881
 
| #26 posted May 6, 2008 at 7:14pm (EDT)
edited May 6, 2008 at 7:15pm (EDT) |
Just curious, as I have no experience dealing with anyone with an active BTR nor would I,but why are people allowed to continue trading with an active BTR? Shouldn't that privilege be revoked until they make right on the past deal? Like I said I have no experience with anyone who has an active BTR so maybe I am missing something or don't understand how it works but it seems like the natural course of action.
"Only Those Born Guilty Recognize Innocence For What It Is:
The Rarest Thing In The Universe,And The Most Precious."
-The Anointed,The Finder of The Way |
RDTZ
| | #27 posted May 6, 2008 at 7:24pm (EDT) |
People can still trade with a BTR because it may not be an issue. I seem to recall one bullcrap BTR that was filed against someone. Something about a dead cat?
"If there is a God, he is within. You don't ask God to give you things, you depend on God for your inner theme."
-Bruce Lee
|
Belladonna
| | #28 posted May 6, 2008 at 7:32pm (EDT) |
RDTZ wrote:
> People can still trade with a BTR because it may not be an issue.
> I seem to recall one bullcrap BTR that was filed against someone.
> Something about a dead cat?
>
Nah....that was HybridCrow complaining he couldnt find any pussy |
RDTZ
| | #29 posted May 6, 2008 at 7:33pm (EDT) |
Potatoe Potato.
"If there is a God, he is within. You don't ask God to give you things, you depend on God for your inner theme."
-Bruce Lee
|
BoB
| | #30 posted May 6, 2008 at 7:59pm (EDT) |
100 high fives
i havent been fudgeed like that since grade school - marla |
BrotherJohn0881
| | #31 posted May 6, 2008 at 7:59pm (EDT) |
RDTZ wrote:
> People can still trade with a BTR because it may not be an issue.
> I seem to recall one bullcrap BTR that was filed against someone.
> Something about a dead cat?
>
LOL
"Only Those Born Guilty Recognize Innocence For What It Is:
The Rarest Thing In The Universe,And The Most Precious."
-The Anointed,The Finder of The Way |
Noltillian
| | #32 posted May 6, 2008 at 8:37pm (EDT) |
I guess that I agree with revoking the trading privileges of people with BTRs. If it's a bogus BTR, then it shouldn't be too hard to get it dismissed.
 |
Forgotten_Freshness
 
| | #33 posted May 6, 2008 at 9:05pm (EDT) |
I agree with the whole "humiliation tactic", with the huge red letters and all that letting people know they shouldn't be traded with. Something simple like "I'M A BAD TRADER, DON'T TRADE WITH ME". Oh yes.
 |
MightySlacker
| | #34 posted May 6, 2008 at 9:16pm (EDT) |
Belladonna wrote:
> RDTZ wrote:
>> People can still trade with a BTR because it may not be an issue.
>> I seem to recall one bullcrap BTR that was filed against someone.
>> Something about a dead cat?
>>
>
>
> Nah....that was HybridCrow complaining he couldnt find any pussy
GOLD.
Dave
2004-07-22 17:30:17 Morph Mr. Funny man, get ready to have ur life get funnier
HAS HE LEARNED ANYTHING IN A YEAR?
7-Sep-2005 11:04pm Morph keep it up mighty i will have you nailed for harassment
HELL NO! |
bill
| | #35 posted May 7, 2008 at 8:14am (EDT) |
BrotherJohn0881 - since the BTR system is open (anyone can file a BTR on anyone else at any time) we also don't attach limitations on people getting them. BTRs are also one person's word against another. Often, it's not clear to everyone who is at fault. So, if we always punish the receiver of the BTR, this could easily become unfair. Plus, it should be enough that they have the BTR. Certainly, it becomes very hard to make trades once you have a BTR. Some people have done it, but generally they have to send first (even if they had 12 gold stars before the BTR).
We do take down bogus BTRs, when we can, but it's not always clear and there are many shades of grey. If you're looking for a good example of an unclear BTR, check out this topic: http://gametz.com/forum/Site_Feedback/topic/300869... (closetQueen's BTR on syntaxcoma). Should syntaxcoma not be allowed to trade because of that BTR? I don't know, he seems to have made a case that closetQueen is causing the BTR to not be resolved because of poor handling of things.
Plus, it's important to remember that all we can really do is stop people from using the trading system. We can't actually stop them from making trades. The two are not the same thing. I know it seems like they are for regulars, but if we block people from using it, many will just workaround it and make trades outside the system (which I feel would make things worse). |
BrotherJohn0881
| | #36 posted May 7, 2008 at 10:12am (EDT) |
Thanks Bill, I hear what your saying. At what point do they get banned though? I have seen some people with 3 or 4 active BTR's. Why somebody would trade with someone who has numerous BTR's and not make them send first is beyond me. I find it hard to feel bad for someone who was so blinded by the desire for a new game that they throw their common sense out the window.
"Only Those Born Guilty Recognize Innocence For What It Is:
The Rarest Thing In The Universe,And The Most Precious."
-The Anointed,The Finder of The Way |
bill
| | #37 posted May 7, 2008 at 11:18am (EDT) |
If some time goes by (a month or two) and the BTR(s) don't get resolved, then we may suspend them. It's really about how much attention the case gets.
I don't think there's a big problem with people trading with BTR'd members. My impression is that's rare. |
benstylus
| | #38 posted May 7, 2008 at 11:22am (EDT) |
and when they do, i think it's probably the BTR'd member sending first 99% of the time.
Need a small short-term loan?
Ask benstylus. |
BrotherJohn0881
| | #39 posted May 7, 2008 at 11:31am (EDT) |
Thanks 
"Only Those Born Guilty Recognize Innocence For What It Is:
The Rarest Thing In The Universe,And The Most Precious."
-The Anointed,The Finder of The Way |
Chad
| | #40 posted May 7, 2008 at 1:25pm (EDT) |
brad still owes me $60 and i havent btr'd him yet. that makes me better than all of you. |
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