| | | Author | Message |
|---|
benstylus
  
 
| | #1 posted May 9, 2008 at 12:53am (EDT) |
bill, what's it going to take to get sheesh out of the forums permanently? It seems like all he ever does is throw insults, arguments, or start up trouble.
I didn't want it to come to this, because sheesh will feel vindicated if he is restricted/banned again (he's got the mindset of a martyr). I know that letting sheesh feel victorious exactly what people don't want, but I say we should let him have that victory. It's an empty one for him. He'll be able to play the martyr card, but the important fact is he'll have to play it somewhere else.
I've had him filtered for a good long while because of his antagonistic and arrogant diatribes, and citizen_zane's betting thread was enough to convince me to read what he had to say for one day... and he hasn't changed a bit, nor is he ever likely to.
So, bill, what's it going to take? Ten site regulars agreeing? You can find probably find more than that already in the betting thread.
If you'd have to refund him for his subtime, I'll gladly buy at least 3 times as much as he currently has to make up for it. If it's about his single pending trade, I'll personally find and send the guy a mint/complete Kingdom Hearts 2 if Sheesh doesn't finish the trade.
I know you want this site to be as un-moderated as possible, but surely when a majority of folks can agree there is a problem user, something should be done about it.
If anyone else wants to toss in their two cents, feel free - but keep it civil and give actual reasons why you do or don't want sheesh removed.
I'll even refrain from the wife comments.
Need a small short-term loan?
Ask benstylus. | MightySlacker
 
 
| | #2 posted May 9, 2008 at 12:58am (EDT) |
This thread will be great. However, the fact that YOU started it kills any seriousness and credibility it may have had as soon as bill starts looking through posts.
I don't really care one way or another about the guy. However, people find humorous and creative ways to bash him, so I guess in a twisted way I'd vote for him to stay.
Dave
2004-07-22 17:30:17 Morph Mr. Funny man, get ready to have ur life get funnier
HAS HE LEARNED ANYTHING IN A YEAR?
7-Sep-2005 11:04pm Morph keep it up mighty i will have you nailed for harassment
HELL NO! | benstylus
| | #3 posted May 9, 2008 at 1:11am (EDT) |
MightySlacker wrote:
> This thread will be great. However, the fact that YOU started it
> kills any seriousness and credibility it may have had as soon as bill
> starts looking through posts.
Nah, I think I'm pretty credible when it comes to the site_feedback forum. This place is like holy ground - people who otherwise may just goof off in the forums can provide serious and meaningful discussions here.
(Besides, over the past week I've scanned and uploaded probably around 300 pictures for items that didn't have them - I hope that boosts my credibility as looking out for the interests of the site)
Need a small short-term loan?
Ask benstylus. | Visc
 
| | #4 posted May 9, 2008 at 1:11am (EDT) |
I'd be in favor of this.
 | thunderdonkey
 
| | #5 posted May 9, 2008 at 1:21am (EDT) |
While we're at it, why don't we do the same to this dtp11 punk? | Iced
| | #6 posted May 9, 2008 at 1:24am (EDT) |
There has definitely been an influx of Sheesh shenanigans as of late. | Admiral
 
| | #7 posted May 9, 2008 at 1:30am (EDT) |
It's alsmot as though he's high all the time or something...
<shrug> | SmarmySir
| | #8 posted May 9, 2008 at 1:37am (EDT) |
Here's one + for dtp11 being removed. He definitely needs to go.
Sheesh? He can be pleasant AT TIMES, but those times are few and far in-between. I wouldn't miss him, but he provides some ridiculous entertainment during the more boring parts of the week. He's only slightly better than useless.
In short, I'd rather see dtp11 gone than Sheesh.
----------------------------------------------
My tee-shirt shop.
My Ebay store. | thunderdonkey
| | #9 posted May 9, 2008 at 1:39am (EDT) |
So Tim, why don't you start a thread for that? It would hold a lot more bearing coming from you as a than from me as a  .
I'll be the first to post in it tho...  | CoachMcGuirk
| | #10 posted May 9, 2008 at 3:34am (EDT) |
Sheesh at least makes things interesting. I say he stays. | DR_SPOCK
 
| | #11 posted May 9, 2008 at 4:42am (EDT) |
I question your idea of "interesting"...
eBay Listings
Amazon Storefront | CoachMcGuirk
| | #12 posted May 9, 2008 at 4:44am (EDT) |
So, did you get Battletoads yet? | DR_SPOCK
| | #13 posted May 9, 2008 at 4:58am (EDT) |
Not yet!! Hopefully tomorrow (TODAY!!).
eBay Listings
Amazon Storefront | CoachMcGuirk
| | #14 posted May 9, 2008 at 5:05am (EDT) |
Last time I played through it I couldn't get past the snake level (I think it's level 8). | bill
  
| | #15 posted May 9, 2008 at 5:23am (EDT) |
If there's a clear mandate from the GameTZ community, I would be willing to give Sheesh a long restriction (a year). I was very close to doing this a few months ago, but things cooled off. I've been avoiding the recent Sheesh-related BS, though. Actually, I'm feeling fairly neutral and thus willing to act.
Refunding his remaining subtime (or anyone's really) is no problem, either way.
Probably my biggest concern is that once we actually do this, then we'll create a witch hunt mentality (or strengthen the mentality we already have), and there will then be a frequent demand to ban someone or other, because it will start seeming like what we do. And, I think that's mostly not healthy. Though, perhaps, it's somewhat fun. I see there's another topic here titled "Ban dtp11", hm.
From my perspective, it's important that I don't get too involved because that will make me unhappy. If doing this results in me interacting with Sheesh (or other annoying personages) directly, a lot, that would be bad. | CoachMcGuirk
| | #16 posted May 9, 2008 at 5:29am (EDT) |
Ban Chad. Tell him he can't come back to the fantasy world. | Pyramid_Party
| | #17 posted May 9, 2008 at 7:03am (EDT) |
I think banning should only be for bad traders or someone whos very bad in the forums or a combo of both. I dont see why people wanna ban someone because they dont agree with their beliefs. When you look at it, theres others who have the same behavior. I dont really see Sheesh as a problem. Ive had more trouble with others trash talking me over my opionions than him, in fact he hasnt done anything wrong to me. If people dont like to argue or hear someone then why do the arguing with them? They are just as much to blame. And the way I see it, they are only angry because they arent the one "winning" with their opinions. Ive noticed that certain users have this feeling that they control the forums and people have to put up with it or you end up getting attacked. All ti takes is an arguement with one, and all the buddies come in. Not to defend over what you said really, just to jump in just for the sake of it. I usually just shrug this stuff off when I have it out with somebody. Its like, the person creates the topic to start a debate or fight, but then gets angry at what certain people have to say.
My solution is, if you hate someone that much just filter them, or just dont post in the topic and argue with them. I dont see why this has to affect a trader here. If the person is a good trader then my punish them for what they say in a thread. Lots of people are victims of these thread bullies that go around fighting with others. why dont they get banned? Its the same users stirring up the crap in all the threads. I think we should pay attention more to trading rather than going around forums fighting and then complaining when you might have been the one who instigated the whole thing.
Just my 2 cents, dont have a problem with Sheesh or Benstylus or anyone. Im neutral in this.
Visit My PSP Modding Discussion
| invisibleink
| | #18 posted May 9, 2008 at 7:52am (EDT) |
giving sheesh even a 3 month restriction would be good enough to try to send him a message that the way he goes about his "business" here on the forums is unacceptable. he pisses nearly everyone off in nearly every thread he posts in. isnt that a prerequisite of a troll?
anyway, like i said, give him a 3 month trip and see if when he comes back he has chilled out a bit | Grenadier
| #19 posted May 9, 2008 at 8:07am (EDT)
edited May 9, 2008 at 8:07am (EDT) |
invisibleink wrote:
> giving sheesh even a 3 month restriction would be good enough
> to try to send him a message that the way he goes about
> his "business" here on the forums is unacceptable. he pisses
> nearly everyone off in nearly every thread he posts
> in. isnt that a prerequisite of a troll?
Not really. Just because everyone disagrees with him doesn't make him a troll. It makes him unpopular.
A troll is more a case of someone like DragonLordFrodo, who purposefully started garbage threads in an effort to make trouble or gain attention. Sheesh does this occasionally, but more often than not he's just (obnoxiously) stating his opinion, just like everyone else. There's a (slight) distinction there, somewhere, which I'm having trouble defining, but I think it does exist. The question is, when does Sheesh cross that line (or did he already?)
Click here to join Goozex and get a free game! | invisibleink
| | #20 posted May 9, 2008 at 8:11am (EDT) |
i didnt say anything about anyone liking him did i? i said he comes in a thread and pisses everyone off. | benstylus
| #21 posted May 9, 2008 at 8:11am (EDT)
edited May 9, 2008 at 8:54am (EDT) |
Honestly, I think the situation for dtp will get taken care of on its own. He's a new user with a chip on his shoulder, and eventually he'll either get the message or get tired of arguing.
Sheesh, on the other hand, has been here for nearly two and a half years, and that chip on his shoulder has only gotten bigger with each restriction he's received. I honestly think he's beyond help.
I would not be against giving him a significant restriction and a "final warning" of sorts to shape up if you feel that's the action that should be taken, bill.
I will say, however, that I personally believe Sheesh is probably unlikely to change his ways even after such warning, so in the end he would probably need to be expunged anyway - shouting his conspiracy "clique" theories to the very end. If it were up to me, I would remove him now (at least from the forums - he doesn't really appear to have any trading problems) so as not to have to do it again in the future.
Sheesh has clearly stated (post #124 in this thread) what everyone already believed to begin with - that his purpose anywhere he goes is to advance his political agenda. As this is a game trading site, I would be far more apt to think we should keep him around if his purpose was to advance his Playstation collecting agenda, or perhaps advance his sealed game collection agenda. But he's going to continue to push his politics in his particularly smarmy and arrogant fashion, and every restriction and complaint only makes his resolve stronger. Now discussing politics is one thing (one thing that usually ends badly), actively pushing an agenda here is another thing entirely.
As for the suggestion to filter him, I'm sure many people (myself included) already have. That's akin to covering up a hole in the wall with a painting - it doesn't make the hole go away, it just keeps you from seeing it - but you still know it's there and that you'll have to deal with it eventually.
Need a small short-term loan?
Ask benstylus. | Grenadier
| | #22 posted May 9, 2008 at 9:00am (EDT) |
benstylus wrote:
> As for the suggestion to filter him, I'm sure many people
> (myself included) already have. That's akin to covering
> up a hole in the wall with a painting - it doesn't make
> the hole go away, it just keeps you from seeing it - but
> you still know it's there and that you'll have to deal with
> it eventually.
Why? Why would you have to deal with it? Filtering does deal with it. By your own admission, you had him filtered, but then took the filter off to check out what he was posting. It's not his fault that you're curious.
We hear people say "don't feed the trolls" all the time, but then they go and do just that. If no one took the flamebait, he'd have no one to argue with. But you guys feed into it every time, then whine about what an ass Sheesh is. If he is the attention whore you claim, then he's won because you've just given him that attention.
Do not reply to him. Do not post in his threads. Do not even read his posts, using filtering if necessary. Problem solved. Why is there this need to control what other people do and say? It used to be that the mods got called "mod nazis" for doing that. How is having a group of "clique nazis" any better or different?
Click here to join Goozex and get a free game! | zylo
| #23 posted May 9, 2008 at 9:03am (EDT)
edited May 9, 2008 at 9:06am (EDT) |
If you do a Forum search on Sheesh's name, you'll see that he has made about 30 posts in the past 5 days, nearly all of them being lame accusations or jokes.
He says things like "I'm sure that you don't have a significant other" or "You probably still live at home with your parents" and does a lot of self-righteous posing about how he's a triumphant liberal homemaker whose main disappointment in life is that his young son wasn't interested in viewing torture photos.
The main conclusion that I've reached about him is that he has excessive free time to annoy and antagonize others, yet paradoxically, he thinks that he is the winner in life, because he found a wife that pays for his Internet lifestyle. I didn't bother to look far enough back to find a post that says I AM A TROLL in red letters, but I think that restricting him for a while would actually be good for him, because he might find better activities to do with his colossal leisure time.
We are approaching summer, which is generally a time of poor-quality Television programming (reruns). He doesn't seem like the type that goes out to the movie theater often. He's going to be even more bored at home ... and itching for some forum trollin' to keep him entertained.
I don't care if the best approach is for everyone to filter him or for him to be restricted ... either way, he needs to get a life other than laundry, baking, and forum trolling. | MolestoTheClown
| | #24 posted May 9, 2008 at 9:25am (EDT) |
Let's ban bill and the rest of the mods! Then we can start our own community, kind of like Lord of the Flies. That turned out pretty well, didn't it?
 | benstylus
| | #25 posted May 9, 2008 at 9:31am (EDT) |
Grenadier wrote:
> benstylus wrote:
>> As for the suggestion to filter him, I'm sure many people
>> (myself included) already have. That's akin to covering
>> up a hole in the wall with a painting - it doesn't make
>> the hole go away, it just keeps you from seeing it - but
>> you still know it's there and that you'll have to deal with
>> it eventually.
>
> Why? Why would you have to deal with it?
Sheesh is interested primarily in one thing, and that's pushing his political agenda. Even if all the currently active users filtered him, he'd attempt to push it onto the new users/anyone who would still listen.
A normal troll is easy to deal with - just ignore it and it gets bored and goes away. A troll with a purpose on the other hand, never gets bored and thus has to be dealt with differently.
Filtering Sheesh essentially gives him a free license to say whatever he wants without any repercussions whatsoever. Not only that, it only seems to strengthen his resolve. His particular brand of posting is often a mix of politics and jabs at other users (who may or may not have him filtered). That sort of stuff should have consequences, not just "I don't see it, so it doesn't matter."
Need a small short-term loan?
Ask benstylus. | Grenadier
| | #26 posted May 9, 2008 at 9:46am (EDT) |
benstylus wrote:
> Filtering Sheesh essentially gives him a free license to
> say whatever he wants without any repercussions whatsoever.
> Not only that, it only seems to strengthen his resolve.
> His particular brand of posting is often a mix of politics
> and jabs at other users (who may or may not have him filtered).
> That sort of stuff should have consequences, not just "I
> don't see it, so it doesn't matter."
Again, why? Why is this one user/troll different than any of the other trollish users who frequent the site? We have plenty of users who do nothing but make jabs at other users on a regular basis. At least Sheesh has a point he's trying to make, however much he might be failing to make it.
Bill has taken a stance of being "hands off" when it comes to flame wars and the like. What makes Sheesh any different that he needs to be singled out for special treatment?
Click here to join Goozex and get a free game! | _kate_
| | #27 posted May 9, 2008 at 9:57am (EDT) |
Sheesh is irritating from time to time, but he's not really doing anything wrong.
Ban him if he starts getting dozens of unresolved BTRs and crap.
Otherwise, just stop reading his posts. They're not particularly obscene or anything, after all.
 | benstylus
| | #28 posted May 9, 2008 at 10:16am (EDT) |
Grenadier wrote:
> Again, why? Why is this one user/troll different than any of the
> other trollish users who frequent the site? We have plenty of users
> who do nothing but make jabs at other users on a regular basis. At
> least Sheesh has a point he's trying to make, however much he might
> be failing to make it.
That's the whole issue right there - he's trying to make a point, and will keep trying beyond any measure of common sense or reason as to where to stop.
Most of the "troll" users are new users on the site, and they eventually become reasonable or leave the site. Even the ones that have been around for years mostly know where the line of indiscretion is, and they know not to go too far past it. Sheesh leaps beyond the line every chance he gets.
Need a small short-term loan?
Ask benstylus. | Grenadier
| | #29 posted May 9, 2008 at 10:32am (EDT) |
_kate_ wrote:
> Otherwise, just stop reading his posts.
QFT, since Ben seems to have missed it.
Click here to join Goozex and get a free game! | Chad
| #30 posted May 9, 2008 at 11:24am (EDT)
edited May 9, 2008 at 11:25am (EDT) |
MolestoTheClown wrote:
> Let's ban bill and the rest of the mods! Then we can start our own
> community, kind of like Lord of the Flies. That turned out pretty
> well, didn't it?
>
>
youre piggy! | mmm40x
| | #31 posted May 9, 2008 at 11:33am (EDT) |
THE PEOPLE DEMAND TWO WAY FILTERS!!! | Iced
| | #32 posted May 9, 2008 at 11:34am (EDT) |
That's likely the best idea I've ever seen on this website, ever. | kzn
| | #33 posted May 9, 2008 at 11:35am (EDT) |
Pyramid_Party wrote:
> I think banning should only be for bad traders or someone whos very
> bad in the forums or a combo of both. I dont see why people wanna
> ban someone because they dont agree with their beliefs. When you look
> at it, theres others who have the same behavior. I dont really see
> Sheesh as a problem. Ive had more trouble with others trash talking
> me over my opionions than him, in fact he hasnt done anything wrong
> to me. If people dont like to argue or hear someone then why do the
> arguing with them? They are just as much to blame. And the way I see
> it, they are only angry because they arent the one "winning" with
> their opinions. Ive noticed that certain users have this feeling that
> they control the forums and people have to put up with it or you end
> up getting attacked. All ti takes is an arguement with one, and all
> the buddies come in. Not to defend over what you said really, just
> to jump in just for the sake of it. I usually just shrug this stuff
> off when I have it out with somebody. Its like, the person creates
> the topic to start a debate or fight, but then gets angry at what
> certain people have to say.
>
> My solution is, if you hate someone that much just filter them, or
> just dont post in the topic and argue with them. I dont see why this
> has to affect a trader here. If the person is a good trader then my
> punish them for what they say in a thread. Lots of people are victims
> of these thread bullies that go around fighting with others. why dont
> they get banned? Its the same users stirring up the crap in all the
> threads. I think we should pay attention more to trading rather than
> going around forums fighting and then complaining when you might have
> been the one who instigated the whole thing.
>
>
> Just my 2 cents, dont have a problem with Sheesh or Benstylus or anyone.
> Im neutral in this.
>
QFFT.
 | kzn
| | #34 posted May 9, 2008 at 11:35am (EDT) |
Iced wrote:
> That's likely the best idea I've ever seen on this website, ever.
I concur. I dont want them to see me when I filter them.
Do it!
| SmarmySir
| | #35 posted May 9, 2008 at 11:38am (EDT) |
What is a two way filter?
----------------------------------------------
My tee-shirt shop.
My Ebay store. | Visc
| #36 posted May 9, 2008 at 11:38am (EDT)
edited May 9, 2008 at 11:39am (EDT) |
Filtering or ignoring people like Sheesh simply doesn't work for two reasons mainly.
1) He follows the Jack Thompson method of logic; ignoring him or filtering him is considered an act of defeat and justification to post more idiotic posts and force his agenda on everyone.
2) Its the equivalent, as a prominent comedian once said, of moving a dog turd from the front yard to the back yard; it still stinks.
FIltering just doesn't work because some people, myself included, would rather know whats being said about themselves and if need be counter claims or defend others.
| mmm40x
| #37 posted May 9, 2008 at 11:42am (EDT)
edited May 9, 2008 at 11:50am (EDT) |
_kate_ wrote:
> Sheesh is irritating from time to time, but he's not
> really doing anything wrong.
>
> Ban him if he starts getting dozens of unresolved BTRs
> and crap.
>
> Otherwise, just stop reading his posts. They're not
> particularly obscene or anything, after all.
>
>
Happy Anniversary! Congrats!  | kzn
| | #38 posted May 9, 2008 at 11:43am (EDT) |
Visc wrote:
> FIltering just doesn't work because some people, myself included,
> would rather know whats being said about themselves and if need be
> counter claims or defend others.
>
uh...wha...?
| mmm40x
| #39 posted May 9, 2008 at 11:45am (EDT)
edited May 9, 2008 at 11:46am (EDT) |
SmarmySir wrote:
> What is a two way filter?
>
When you filter someone you won't see them and they can't see you. This would end a lot of the nonsense without anyone being banned.
Do it bill. You said you wanted us to come in here and tell you what to do. So give us filters that work both ways!!! | Visc
| | #40 posted May 9, 2008 at 11:46am (EDT) |
kzn wrote:
> Visc wrote:
>> FIltering just doesn't work because some people, myself included,
>> would rather know whats being said about themselves and if need
> be
>> counter claims or defend others.
>>
> uh...wha...?
>
To put it another way, keep your firends close, and your enemies closer.
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