Politics

Topic   The Religion Thread.

Karaiya
Gold Good Trader Has Written 1 Review
22-Mar-2017(#1)
A place for athiests, agnostics, Christians, Hebrews, Muslims, and other people of faith and non faith to vent it out.

Make posts, articles, give opinions.

Please attempt to be respectful and to not be complete butt-holes to one another. I expect you to hold me to the same standard!

Example of a good post:

"I believe that secularism has had a negative affect on society here is an article"

"Christianity, has not always been kind to other groups in America heres a reference. Thoughts?"

Example of a bad post:

"You godless hippies and baby-killers are ruining this country. You should all be exterminated"

"You right wing evangelical freaks are the reason for all war and racism. Go die in fire sheeple."
Dustin
GameTZ Subscriber 600 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
22-Mar-2017(#2)
I'm 36 years old and have been a Christian my entire life. Not one single thing anyone on the internet says (or anywhere else for that matter) is going to make me change what I believe. I would imagine that everyone else has the same mindset. People are just going to flame each other eventually.
Mexico
GameTZ Subscriber Double Gold Good Trader This user is on the site NOW (9 seconds ago)
22-Mar-2017(#3)
Finally a place where we can talk about white genocide!







No but seriously I consider myself an agnostic nonreligious non practicing christian, basically christ was supposed to be a good person and you should be too but I also live in the real world where sometimes there has to be crapty choices made.
Karaiya
Gold Good Trader Has Written 1 Review
22-Mar-2017(#4)
I guess, I wouldn't consider myself an atheist. I was a Christian (Catholic) most of my life and one day I just woke up in the morning and didnt beleive anymore. The relief and lack of anxiety that followed was so freeing. But I do, pray from time to time. I sometimes pray for others as well. As a person that was Christian I know that is the exact wrong thing to do. Anyway, I struggle with it is all I can say.
louisianaboots
GameTZ Subscriber Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
* 22-Mar-2017(#5)
@Karaiya What do you mean it is the exact wrong thing to do? Pray for other people, Or Not believe but still pray? Just curious as to what you were referencing when you said exact wrong thing to do.
Karaiya
Gold Good Trader Has Written 1 Review
* 22-Mar-2017(#6)
Oh! Praying but not beleiving. Lol. I literally suck at being an atheist and being a Christian simultaneously. Im the worsr kind of person.
louisianaboots
GameTZ Subscriber Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
* 22-Mar-2017(#7)
I can relate to that actually. For example I had a very real feeling experience, I woke up, looked over at my alarm clock. It read 2:59 and turned to 3:00 while I was looking at it. I then started to levitate and spin around above my bed, was dropped back to the bed, and I went back to sleep. I woke up the next morning and prayed.

I still cant tell you for sure if it was a dream or not, I just assume it was because it makes a whole hell of a lot more sense.

I think many people who have grown up in a christian family or around a lot of Christians probably struggle with those antics. (Praying but not believing.)
DiamondDave
GameTZ Subscriber 350 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader Has Written 4 Reviews
22-Mar-2017(#8)
I'm a confirmed Catholic but I haven't been to church in a very long time. Our priest had to resign when I was an adolescent because of a relationship thing (not sure if it was a kid or a consenting adult but it was definitely homosexual) and I never really found another faith leader that I clicked with. After a while I stopped looking.

While I view religion in general lately as a thing that divides more than it brings together, I know plenty of good, positive people with outstanding moral fiber from Jewish, Catholic, Christian, Muslim and Hinduism and I see value in it. But my confirmation into Catholicism was more of a "Doing it to make Mom happy" thing, but I'm the one that chose to do it so I'll own it. I'm more Agnostic now than anything else these days really... I haven't found anything that I can identify with, anything that makes sense. Except for The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild.
Foxhack
GameTZ Subscriber 300 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader Gold Global Trader (7) This user is on the site NOW (5 minutes ago)
22-Mar-2017(#9)
Catholics and Christians who refuse to help others because they think other people are entitled are not true Catholics or Christians and should accept the fact they're basically following the path that Satan wanted.

*mic drop*
POG
Gold Global Trader (8) Has Written 8 Reviews
(frozen)
22-Mar-2017(#10)
Foxhack wrote:
> Catholics and Christians who refuse to help others because they think other people
> are entitled are not true Catholics or Christians and should accept the fact they're
> basically following the path that Satan wanted.
>
> *mic drop*

This can literally be said about every single religion.

I am an Atheist. I have been since the age of 13. I went through a span during college where I despised Christianity because of what it did to the ancient world (burning libraries, destroying science, destroying culture, etc.). However, after 2000+ years of Christianity in Europe I see how culturally Christianity could be a positive for Western Civilization. Under an ideal ideology I would hope to see Christianity slowly dissolved and we start looking to science more. Even a spiritual connection to nature and family (culture) is better than the modern religions.

theJaw
GameTZ Subscriber Triple Gold Good Trader Secret Santa
* 22-Mar-2017(#11)
I love people from my local church. I met them as a kid, and have known a lot of them my entire life. They're great people, and were great people even after I acknowledged a lack of belief. Church and religion, when approached with a level head, can be an incredible thing. A sense of peace, place in the world, and community. That's what everyone strives for and so many can't find.

However, when you start living by the ancient ideals that every religion stemmed from, it becomes an issue. When these religions were founded by man, life was wholly different in every aspect. Rape, murder, pillage - it was all commonplace. So when the scribes wrote these tales that people now live their lives by, they reflected the era in which they were living. That era is long gone. The morals that these faiths preach are still a goal to many people, religious or not. It's just a shame that these stories got muddled down in the modern mind by the ancient practices prominent during the times they were written. Groups like ISIS are still adhering to this ancient mindset when the majority of the planet, again religious or not, have moved on from said ideals. Other less prominently-covered groups exist within other sects of people. Hate has become over-saturated.

In my opinion, morals are what these stories attempted to preach - people should take the themes away from religious stories and not mistake the depicted fictionalized scenarios as whole truths. Isn't it enough that an interesting man at one point preached stories about heaven, made people feel good about it, and then went on to share these tales to people who wrote them for generations to read? Do they really need to be taken literally in order to find love in your fellow human?

I have the absolute utmost respect for any religious person who can hold faith without having to convince others to. I have the utmost disrespect for any religious person who attempts to sway others into their system of belief without tolerating anybody else. When it becomes violent or hateful, it's an even larger offense.

I leave you with a rabbi, priest, and atheist smoking pot. The acceptance and understanding in this video only strengthens my faith in religious folks, even if I personally don't have faith in any of the Gods they worship. I advocate peace, as hippy and snowflake as some may take that.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TFzy1l_WoAs
Karaiya
Gold Good Trader Has Written 1 Review
* 22-Mar-2017(#12)
Is that black dude the Rabbi?

theJaw
GameTZ Subscriber Triple Gold Good Trader Secret Santa
22-Mar-2017(#13)
hahaha nah, the dude in the very badass hat is.
theJaw
GameTZ Subscriber Triple Gold Good Trader Secret Santa
22-Mar-2017(#14)
Update: okay there are two guys with hats, note badass hat (guy on the left).
Karaiya
Gold Good Trader Has Written 1 Review
22-Mar-2017(#15)
That Rabbi looks like a G

Prime
GameTZ Subscriber Quadruple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
23-Mar-2017(#16)
Religion is an opiate for the masses to keep them in line and well behaved. Man in the sky forbid! I have no issue with faith and people who believe in anything. My issue is when those people try to impose their beliefs on others or tell me that the mere existence of certain things threatens their ability to worship privately on thier own.
Finn
GameTZ Subscriber Quadruple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally Canada
23-Mar-2017(#17)
I am agnostic, I don't like the idea of religion I don't believe that Christianity invented moral's, I also don't believe you need a religion to be a good person. It's used a tool to spread hate and division. I feel as though I am a MUCH better person without it.

yankees7448
Bronze Good Trader
* 23-Mar-2017(#18)
I am agnostic. Long story short I used to be a big believer. I actually was a working brother in my church and was on my way to being made into a Deacon. Then as part of my path I was sent to another congregation. The people were nice but it wasn't the same. I missed my friends and I had to work under a Deacon who treated me like I didn't know what I was doing. I took it upon myself to return to my other congregation. But it then dawned upon me that if I happened to begin my life of faith in another congregation instead of the one I had originally joined I probably would not have continued as far as I did. I realized that what I thought was faith was nothing more than a feeling of belonging that I had been lacking. Like that...POOF the magic was gone. I stopped going to church some time afterwards because it no longer meant anything to me and I felt like I would be taking advantage of people if I continued to go just to spend time with them.

I now consider myself a devout non-believer.
louisianaboots
GameTZ Subscriber Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
23-Mar-2017(#19)
yankees7448 wrote:
> I am agnostic. Long story short I used to be a big believer. I actually was a working
> brother in my church and was on my way to being made into a Deacon. Then as part
> of my path I was sent to another congregation. The people were nice but it wasn't
> the same. I missed my friends and I had to work under a Deacon who treated me like
> I didn't know what I was doing. I took it upon myself to return to my other congregation.
> But it then dawned upon me that if I happened to begin my life of faith in another
> congregation instead of the one I had originally joined I probably would not have
> continued as far as I did. I realized that what I thought was faith was nothing more
> than a feeling of belonging that I had been lacking. Like that...POOF the magic was
> gone. I stopped going to church some time afterwards because it no longer meant anything
> to me and I felt like I would be taking advantage of people if I continued to go
> just to spend time with them.
>
> I now consider myself a devout non-believer.


This makes so much sense. I am also a devout non-believer, and I never have felt I belonged at a church or with one. I have tried many times actually even in my adult life to go to a church and I always have an uneasy and uninviting feeling. Needless to say I have never considered myself religious. So i think you are correct in saying you would never have went that far.

I think many people are still believers for that reason, and they will deny it, but of course, because they dont actually know because they have always felt they belonged there, they havent had that experience like you did.

d3vanj
Triple Gold Good Trader
(frozen)
* 23-Mar-2017(#20)
I don't really know what I am. I believe there is a higher being, or a creator or some crap, but I don't really think any religion has it right. I pray sometimes but don't go to church. I just try to be a good person and help others any way I can.

If heaven is real and I die and get to the gates, and God says 'I know you dedicated a lot of time to helping others and you're a pretty good person, but you didn't believe in me so you're going to hell' then I don't know what happens from there. I'll deal with it when I'm dead I guess.

Finn
GameTZ Subscriber Quadruple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally Canada
24-Mar-2017(#21)
d3vanj wrote:
> I don't really know what I am. I believe there is a higher being, or a creator or
> some crap, but I don't really think any religion has it right. I pray sometimes but
> don't go to church. I just try to be a good person and help others any way I can.
>
>
> If heaven is real and I die and get to the gates, and God says 'I know you dedicated
> a lot of time to helping others and you're a pretty good person, but you didn't believe
> in me so you're going to hell' then I don't know what happens from there. I'll deal
> with it when I'm dead I guess.
>
>


My thought is if there is a god and he gave us free will and I chose to exercise it in the way I chose (agnostic) then he should be proud of that, giving something free will only to punish it for using it to not worship him is not really free will at all.

ninesalone
GameTZ Subscriber Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
* 24-Mar-2017(#22)
I am not religious and never have been. When I was younger, Christianity was pushed on me heavily and I asked tons of questions of the religious leaders I still feel like they never answered. Some would even try to use fear of hell and shaming me as a way to get me to accept it. I was dragged to Church every Sunday for years and I'm sure I was a thorn in their side.

When I was in foster care I used "going to church" as a way to get out of the house and attended every service, every week at a small church that was 1 block from where I lived. Some of these were prayer groups with around 10 people sitting in a circle. I always found this to be the most interesting part of Christianity. Before and after the prayer, conversation would take place about everyone's deepest problems, what they are looking forward to, their family life, going-ons, etc. I got really into it, even though I didn't buy into the concept of god. On one of the nights a woman asked that we pray for her to "better serve her husband" while lambasting herself for all that upset him. The pastor prayed for it and I stopped going. I started looking at other religions. Eventually I scrapped the idea that it was for me at all.

Now I kind of have a more nuanced perspective because I see that religion influences culture. Some great things have come from Christian culture that have allowed our society here in America to progress. Some of their principles on morality stand without the dogma. In other areas I really don't like, like women being subservient to men, though that may be changing. I also like that Christians at least have principles and have things to say on ethics, personal responsibility, promoting healthy families, etc. That seems lacking today.
POG
Gold Global Trader (8) Has Written 8 Reviews
(frozen)
24-Mar-2017(#23)
ninesalone wrote:
> I am not religious and never have been. When I was younger, Christianity was pushed
> on me heavily and I asked tons of questions of the religious leaders I still feel
> like they never answered. Some would even try to use fear of hell and shaming me
> as a way to get me to accept it. I was dragged to Church every Sunday for years and
> I'm sure I was a thorn in their side.
>
> When I was in foster care I used "going to church" as a way to get out of the house
> and attended every service, every week at a small church that was 1 block from where
> I lived. Some of these were prayer groups with around 10 people sitting in a circle.
> I always found this to be the most interesting part of Christianity. After the prayer,
> conversation would take place about everyone's deepest problems, what they are looking
> forward to, their family life, going-ons, etc. I got really into it, even though
> I didn't buy into the concept of god. On one of the nights a woman asked that we
> pray for her to "better serve her husband" while lambasting herself for all that
> upset him. The pastor prayed for it and I stopped going. I started looking at other
> religions. Eventually I scrapped the idea that it was for me at all.
>
> Now I kind of have a more nuanced perspective because I see that religion influences
> culture. Some great things have come from Christian culture that have allowed our
> society here in America to progress. Some of their principles on morality stand without
> the dogma. In other areas I really don't like, like women being subservient to men,
> though that may be changing. I also like that Christians at least have principles
> and have things to say on ethics, personal responsibility, promoting healthy families,
> etc. That seems lacking today.

Awesome post man.

King_link
GameTZ Subscriber Quadruple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
* 6-Apr-2017(#24)
I don't think humans can mentally conceive what ever God is. The shear amount of religions and Gods throughout history is enough to show that we have no idea what is going on in this reality.
yankees7448
Bronze Good Trader
* 8-Apr-2017(#25)
King_link wrote:
> I don't think humans can mentally conceive what ever God is. The shear amount of
> religions and Gods throughout history is enough to show that we have no idea what
> is going on in this reality.

I don't think that is true at all. Its entirely possible to have an idea of what God and what he does if you answer a few questions. If you think God is an all knowing and all powerful being that created everything then you should know there is absolutely no is no evidence for his existence. However, there should not be any evidence because he was all powerful then he created the laws of nature that govern existence and therefore is not bound by those same laws. If he is not all powerful etc. then why are you worshiping him?

For me, the follow up question is much more interesting. However it would be easier to follow if I could manage to create on of those if yes then but if no then _ chart things but here is what I got.

Q1: Does God care enough about what happens here to actively intervene.

A1: Yes
A2: No

Follow up question for A1: Do you think the Universe is much smaller than science suggests or as impossibly large as it suggests.

A3: Yes it is impossibly large.
A4: Its much smaller (My willingness to continue this conversation decreases in proportion to your perception of the universe's size)

Q2: What about the possibility of life on other planets?

A5: The universe is so vast and life is so tenacious that it is mathematically impossible for there not to be nor ever to have been life on other worlds. Intelligent life may be rare however.

A6: There is no life on other planets, there never has been and we won't be traveling to other worlds because the Bible doesn't say we do. For all intents and purposes everything else we see in space was created so that we could have something cool to look at through telescopes.

A7-Only Kolab or that nonsense surrounding Scientology's backstory.

If you answered A6 or A7 then you can stop here.

Q3 If life exists elsewhere what does that mean about our relationship with God?

A8-He cares about us but we're not as special to him as we like to think. Maybe treats us kind of like a curiosity. Like a human life sized version of a living Minecraft game. He'll step in on occasion to see what happens but otherwise watches passively from a distance.

A9- He doesn't give a crap. We're no more important than any other example of life anywhere in the universe.

A10-God loves us all. We're his children and he's reserving a special place in heaven for those who are redeemed. (I told you to stop answering the damned questions).

MikeyWhoa
GameTZ Subscriber Double Gold Good Trader
8-Apr-2017(#26)
I would LOVE to have a serious discussion about Religion. But the questions I have always seem too offensive or insulting. It's never my intent, but I find it nearly impossible to truly discuss.

How can you have a serious discussion when one side thinks that these people believe in a magical invisible higher being, and all of their Holy books are historical fact, while the other side thinks you're hateful, morally empty, and going to hell?
POG
Gold Global Trader (8) Has Written 8 Reviews
(frozen)
* 8-Apr-2017(#27)
MikeyWhoa wrote:
> I would LOVE to have a serious discussion about Religion. But the questions I have
> always seem too offensive or insulting. It's never my intent, but I find it nearly
> impossible to truly discuss.
>
> How can you have a serious discussion when one side thinks that these people believe
> in a magical invisible higher being, and all of their Holy books are historical fact,
> while the other side thinks you're hateful, morally empty, and going to hell?

I quite discussing religion in college for this very reason. I find it a waste of time to try and "debate" it with someone.

It is literally arguing with someone that has a delusion. Nothing good can come of it.

Scots
GameTZ Subscriber Triple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
* 8-Apr-2017(#28)
It's literally not that. yes
DiamondDave
GameTZ Subscriber 350 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader Has Written 4 Reviews
* 9-Apr-2017(#29)
No matter what side of the conversation you're on, if you're arguing, the other side cannot possibly be right, so I could see that statement as being mostly true. If the two of you can agree to disagree and get a cup of coffee and talk about crap that MATTERS in the world around you, well, you're not arguing about religion anymore. Which is a fine idea.

One of my superiors at work is a super-duper conservative Christian. I respect his right to worship and he doesn't call me a soulless heathen; I actually know enough about his religion that when he makes references or jokes I can enjoy them with him, or I can put a religious spin on something and he'll enjoy it. But arguing is completely crap. Absolutely no good whatsoever. That crap starts wars and gets people killed.
POG
Gold Global Trader (8) Has Written 8 Reviews
(frozen)
9-Apr-2017(#30)
Scots wrote:
> It's literally not that. yes

delusion - an idiosyncratic belief or impression that is firmly maintained despite being contradicted by what is generally accepted as reality or rational argument, typically a symptom of mental disorder.

If I came to you and I made up a story about how I could fly because I was imbued with that power from a fox I found in the woods. I said it over and over again. To prove it to you I showed you a book written by someone saying that in some time in the future a fox would appear and imbue a chosen son with the power of flight. However, the only way you could see me fly is if you believed I could fly....

How could you argue with me? What if I REALLY thought that happened? It would be a delusion and you could never convince me otherwise.

MikeyWhoa
GameTZ Subscriber Double Gold Good Trader
9-Apr-2017(#31)
DiamondDave wrote:
> No matter what side of the conversation you're on, if you're arguing, the other side
> cannot possibly be right, so I could see that statement as being mostly true. If
> the two of you can agree to disagree and get a cup of coffee and talk about crap
> that MATTERS in the world around you, well, you're not arguing about religion anymore.
> Which is a fine idea.
>
> One of my superiors at work is a super-duper conservative Christian. I respect his
> right to worship and he doesn't call me a soulless heathen; I actually know enough
> about his religion that when he makes references or jokes I can enjoy them with him,
> or I can put a religious spin on something and he'll enjoy it. But arguing is completely
> crap. Absolutely no good whatsoever. That crap starts wars and gets people killed.

Getting along with a religious person is easy. It's a necessity where I'm from. I'd be unable to forge or maintain a relationship without that ability. It's not hard to look past it.

What is difficult is finding someone to help me understand their belief. My life was steeped in a Baptist, and then Catholic, and back to Baptist upbringing. This includes schooling in my elementary years, church or mass several times a week, bible studies, youth programs. The full-on indoctrination.

And I dove in head first. Church functions, general witnessing, I even changed the things I watched and listened to. (Oh good ol' DC Talk. I still have some of their stuff memorized.) When I was young, we were taught to be able to quote certain scripture forward AND backward (Last verse back to first verse) To this day, I can still do Psalms 23 that way. I just can't understand why it didn't hold for me, while for someone else, it's adhered for life.

However, if asking someone what seems to me would be basic questions you'd ask yourself, you might as well be asking them if their child is actually biologically theirs. In my experience, the most consistently offensive thing you can say to someone when discussing their religion is "But...".
King_link
GameTZ Subscriber Quadruple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
9-Apr-2017(#32)
I think many people are content with not understanding something or just "chalking it up to God's will". Someone like yourself asks questions about things that don't make sense while others don't want to go down that road.
Scots
GameTZ Subscriber Triple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
9-Apr-2017(#33)
Pog, stop being delusional.
Foxhack
GameTZ Subscriber 300 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader Gold Global Trader (7) This user is on the site NOW (5 minutes ago)
* 9-Apr-2017(#34)
Scots wrote:
> Pog, stop being delusional.

You're just jealous my lord and savior gave him the power to fly instead of you.
POG
Gold Global Trader (8) Has Written 8 Reviews
(frozen)
9-Apr-2017(#35)
Foxhack wrote:
> Scots wrote:
>> Pog, stop being delusional.
>
> You're just jealous my lord and savior gave him the power to fly instead of you.

This is true. The reason you can't see it is because you don't believe it.....

Scots
GameTZ Subscriber Triple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
9-Apr-2017(#36)
Mockery of Christianity and religion in general is nothing new. Find a fresh take.
POG
Gold Global Trader (8) Has Written 8 Reviews
(frozen)
9-Apr-2017(#37)
Scots wrote:
> Mockery of Christianity and religion in general is nothing new. Find a fresh take.

I was going to turn you into a pillar of salt...but you are already really salty.

Scots
GameTZ Subscriber Triple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
9-Apr-2017(#38)
Some things get me salty. You posting on GameTZ isn't one of them.
Osiris
300 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader
9-Apr-2017(#39)
either you are a Tree of Knowledge guy or you are not, yes?
MikeyWhoa
GameTZ Subscriber Double Gold Good Trader
9-Apr-2017(#40)
POG wrote:
> Scots wrote:
>> Mockery of Christianity and religion in general is nothing new. Find a fresh take.
>
> I was going to turn you into a pillar of salt...but you are already really salty.
>
>
>

You can't. Scots doesn't look back.
yankees7448
Bronze Good Trader
9-Apr-2017(#41)
POG wrote:
> Scots wrote:
>> Mockery of Christianity and religion in general is nothing new. Find a fresh take.
>
> I was going to turn you into a pillar of salt...but you are already really salty.
>
>
>

Post of the day!!! lol
louisianaboots
GameTZ Subscriber Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
10-Apr-2017(#42)
Oh religion, the most successful scam there ever was.

Jurassic_Shift
Has Written 13 Reviews
(abandoned)
21-Apr-2017(#43)
Try watching some of the evolution vs creation debates on youtube if you like to smash your face against brick walls. Also, old earth vs young earth christian debates are fun too.
King_link
GameTZ Subscriber Quadruple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
29-Apr-2017(#44)
It's sad how little the vast majority of people are taught/know about the mechanics of evolution. Ask any average Joe what they know about it and they will tell you that we come from monkeys, which isn't the case at all. I think it scares religious people because they think they have to denounce God in order to accept the evidence of evolution, which isn't true either. We're not 100% sure what sparked the beginning of complex life, we do have a good idea, but we're pretty spot on when it comes to showing how all life arrived where they are today.
Osiris
300 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader
29-Apr-2017(#45)
I thought it was the monolith?

Topic   The Religion Thread.