General

Topic   Sales tax coming to all online sales

paul6743
Gold Good Trader
* 21-Jun-2018(#1)
Supreme Court rules states can force online retailers to collect sales tax

>The Supreme Court ruled Thursday that states can compel retailers to collect sales taxes even if they don't have a physical presence in the state.

Not sure if this applies to second-hand items on eBay and such. I can't seem to find a clear answer for that.
Feeb
GameTZ Subscriber Triple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
21-Jun-2018(#2)
Every where I move has an amazon distribution center so I've been accustomed - only online retailer we really use. Good info though.
paul6743
Gold Good Trader
21-Jun-2018(#3)
Amazon has already been collecting sales tax in all states (that have sales tax) for a while, so it doesn't really concern them. It's Newegg and eBay that has me concerned.
Feeb
GameTZ Subscriber Triple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
21-Jun-2018(#4)
Ah. I thought it was because they were down the road. Lol.
Ranchan
Has Written 9 Reviews
(frozen)
21-Jun-2018(#5)
I'm certainly concerned with the ruling. Depending on how the state laws are written, states could theoretically require sales tax to be collected on transactions involving money at GTZ. I.e., if you sell a video game for 10 bucks on GTZ to a person living in the U.S., the buyer's state could require the seller to collect and then remit the sales tax on the transaction.
Sam
Quadruple Gold Good Trader Has Written 5 Reviews
21-Jun-2018(#6)
The image Court
Feeb
GameTZ Subscriber Triple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
21-Jun-2018(#7)
Sam. I'd like to smoke a few bowls with you and watch fear and loathing. Fudging bat country.
Sam
Quadruple Gold Good Trader Has Written 5 Reviews
21-Jun-2018(#8)
I prefer Where The Buffalo Roam, but def
Feeb
GameTZ Subscriber Triple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
21-Jun-2018(#9)
Word. Let's do it.
secret_defender
Quadruple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
21-Jun-2018(#10)
At various flea markets and such they don't charge sales tax which is really same concept as ebay except business or who sell alot. I doubt i will buy anything online if tax is added, one reason why i don't go in stores.

Dumb rule but that won't stop people from buying online. There was a place where if you mailed in your payment instead of online get 20% off, very few took it, i know cause i helped that place out from time to time. As a example.
Foxhack
GameTZ Subscriber 300 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader
21-Jun-2018(#11)
Fudge Neil Gorsuch.
bonanza125
700 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
22-Jun-2018(#12)
secret_defender wrote:
> At various flea markets and such they don't charge sales tax which is really same
> concept as ebay except business or who sell alot. I doubt i will buy anything online
> if tax is added, one reason why i don't go in stores.

Depends on what state and place. Some states require it some don't. The problem on both ends is that the law isn't clear nor policed enough to enforce at a flea market.
razeak
Double Gold Good Trader Has Written 9 Reviews
22-Jun-2018(#13)
Foxhack wrote:
> Fudge Neil Gorsuch.

Just him? haha okay.
Porksta
GameTZ Subscriber 350 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
22-Jun-2018(#14)
Ebay, Amazon, and flea markets are all secondary markets and thus don't require sales tax, correct? Ebay and Amazon already require you to pay taxes if you are a business. If I set up a table at a flea market I wouldn't expect to have to pay taxes.

Demonis
Silver Good Trader
22-Jun-2018(#15)
While being tax free has been a fun ride, it really has taken advantage of the system. States need those taxes.
Ranchan
Has Written 9 Reviews
(frozen)
* 22-Jun-2018(#16)
Porksta wrote:
> Ebay, Amazon, and flea markets are all secondary markets and thus don't require sales
> tax, correct? Ebay and Amazon already require you to pay taxes if you are a business.
> If I set up a table at a flea market I wouldn't expect to have to pay taxes.
>
Again, it depends on the way the state sales tax laws are written. The original Supreme Court cases focused on the seller's presence within the state. If the seller had a physical presence within the state, yes collect online sales tax. No presence, then no. The recent decision overturned this focus of seller's physical presence.

I HOPE states will EXEMPT individual, non-business sellers from collecting sales taxes. But the S.C. cases don't explicitly bar states from requiring individuals from collecting sales tax on their individual online sales.

Here's another food for thought--the sales proceeds from items sold on secondary markets are technically taxable income to the seller and should be included in their personal income tax return as "Hobby Income." Now, the recent South Dakota v. Wayfair decision could pave the way for taxes on all online sales.

Add: by definition, a flea market is a physical location with physical buyer-seller transactions. We're not talking about these sales because they are conducted OFFLINE.
Scots
Bronze Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
22-Jun-2018(#17)
This shouldn't affect eBay and GameTZ and other such things mentioned. The ruling mentions big business specifically.

Makes sense to me. There's not really any reason why stores that happen to have physical locations be taxed more/differently than stores that don't.
Foxhack
GameTZ Subscriber 300 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader
22-Jun-2018(#18)
Scots wrote:
> This shouldn't affect eBay and GameTZ and other such things mentioned. The ruling
> mentions big business specifically.
>
> Makes sense to me. There's not really any reason why stores that happen to have physical
> locations be taxed more/differently than stores that don't.

eBay just sent me an email with a link to a petition where they ask this ruling be reversed. So it's very likely going to affect us, or at least eBay.
justin_credible
Gold Good Trader
22-Jun-2018(#19)
I don't see how it's possible that it could effect GameTZ. It's like going to a garage sale.
Porksta
GameTZ Subscriber 350 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
22-Jun-2018(#20)
justin_credible wrote:
> I don't see how it's possible that it could effect GameTZ. It's like going to a garage
> sale.
Especially with the prices people expect you to sell things for.

Zing!

Foxhack
GameTZ Subscriber 300 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader
* 22-Jun-2018(#21)
justin_credible wrote:
> I don't see how it's possible that it could effect GameTZ. It's like going to a garage
> sale.

Sorry, by us I meant eBay / ecommerce sellers.

I agree with folks here about this not really affecting person-to-person or occasional sales.
justin_credible
Gold Good Trader
* 22-Jun-2018(#22)
Foxhack wrote:
> justin_credible wrote:
>> I don't see how it's possible that it could effect GameTZ. It's like going to
> a garage
>> sale.
>
> Sorry, by us I meant eBay / ecommerce sellers.
>
> I agree with folks here about this not really affecting person-to-person or occasional
> sales.

I'm referring to this by Ranchan

" if you sell a video game for 10 bucks on GTZ to a person living in the U.S., the buyer's state could require the seller to collect and then remit the sales tax on the transaction."

That's not going to happen, because the state won't even know the transaction took place. Unless Paypal was forced to include tax on all transactions including gifted paypal. Heck even if they did we could still have a workaround by sending cash then it's untraceable. The bad thing about that of course is someone could say they never got the cash and there'd be no record of it which is one of the many reasons why we prefer Paypal in the first place. Regardless, I just can't see there being a tax for gifted Paypal.
Feeb
GameTZ Subscriber Triple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
* 22-Jun-2018(#23)
IRS expects you to report income from qualified items you sell. Some states as well. They have some guidelines on their site.
justin_credible
Gold Good Trader
* 22-Jun-2018(#24)
Feeb wrote:
> IRS expects you to report income from qualified items you sell. Some states as well.
> They have some guidelines on their site.

They could expect it I doubt one person from GameTZ would actually do it. There'd be no consequence because GameTZ is not like Ebay.

This is the garage sales of internet, can't tax it.
Feeb
GameTZ Subscriber Triple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
* 22-Jun-2018(#25)
Only appreciated collectibles are expected. We usually don't even ask for our costs back.
justin_credible
Gold Good Trader
* 22-Jun-2018(#26)
Feeb wrote:
> Only appreciated collectibles are expected. We usually don't even ask for our costs
> back.

There could be examples of appreciated collectibles sold on here. Plenty of them.

Earthbound, you bought it when it came out for $70 or whatever it cost retail. Now it's worth $3-400. But again, no one's headed to that IRS site and reporting it because IRS isn't coming on GameTZ to verify it, or maybe someone would but I can guarantee most wouldn't. Probably none except maybe someone like Forgotten_Freshness who has a store.
Feeb
GameTZ Subscriber Triple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
* 22-Jun-2018(#27)
That's true.

I've never reported any small items or sales on eBay etc. You'd most likely be safe from audit if it wasn't a large source of income. It's an honor system.
secret_defender
Quadruple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
22-Jun-2018(#28)
Maybe about different states but i know TN and AL no tax for flea markets. In some places no tax on second time around items or used; junk stores.

I never got this ebay message. Won't work anyway unless 80-85% or more of the whole population sign it, it is highly unlikely as i said almost no one cares.

As for needing it, i would have to say no. States have stayed in budget and even getting out of debt without this for how long? And other reasons. Gov don't need more money to waste, that is what they do best. Or the money could just just collect dust, at one point IN had a big surplus and all the leader did is let the money sit when many different things could have used it for. Just one example.
Sam
Quadruple Gold Good Trader Has Written 5 Reviews
22-Jun-2018(#29)
Im always hearing about sales tax but when are they gonna flip it and hit us with some tax sales.. like tax becomes 4.2% instead of 7 or whatever for a weekend
bonanza125
700 Trade Quintuple Gold Good Trader Global Trader - willing to trade internationally
22-Jun-2018(#30)
justin_credible wrote:
> Foxhack wrote:
>> justin_credible wrote:
> |>
Unless Paypal was forced to include tax on all transactions including gifted
> paypal. Heck even if they did we could still have a workaround by sending cash then
> it's untraceable. The bad thing about that of course is someone could say they never
> got the cash and there'd be no record of it which is one of the many reasons why
> we prefer Paypal in the first place. Regardless, I just can't see there being a tax
> for gifted Paypal.

That's exactly what the state will do. On every transaction through Paypal and other services no matter if its a gift payment or goods payment they will force an online sales tax.
Ranchan
Has Written 9 Reviews
(frozen)
23-Jun-2018(#31)
bonanza125 wrote:
>
> That's exactly what the state will do. On every transaction through Paypal and other
> services no matter if its a gift payment or goods payment they will force an online
> sales tax.

Exactly. States could enact laws that force paypal and other services to: a) report transactions (i.e. transfers that aren't self-identified as friend/family); b) impose a surcharge based on the recipient's verified addresses that are located within the states.

re: tax enforcement. Let me give you the example of Coinbase. It's a platform where people buy and sell digital currency. In the past, there were questions of whether proceeds from sales of digital currencies were taxable. Now that the IRS has determined it is, they have forced Coinbase to disclose transactions involving a certain amount of money.

Here's an article on this disclosure of Coinbase accounts to IRS:

https://www.theverge.com/2018/2/26/17055264/coinba...


Just because states CURRENTLY don't force sellers to collect online sales tax, it doesn't mean that they won't ask companies that offer digital/mobile payment service (such as paypal, google, samsung, apple, amazon, etc.) for information in the future to enforce their sales tax laws/regulations.
Ranchan
Has Written 9 Reviews
(frozen)
23-Jun-2018(#32)
re: gifted paypal. If you do a ton of gifted paypal transactions, the tax authorities may determine that you're really conducting business rather than personal transactions. or the account could end up being flagged for money laundering. My point is that simply using gifted paypal doesn't buy you protection and it could raise its own can of worms.

Topic   Sales tax coming to all online sales