lakerdodgerfan BTRs

Status: bad trader (This account is not active)
Manhattan Beach, California, United StatesUnited States
Has traded with 102 Different Traders (118 total trades)
Ratings are excellent [94%] [99 ratings]
Last login: on 12-Aug-2005 at 4:32am
Subscriber: not currently subscribed
Member since: 1-Jun-2002
Incidents Reported: 2
Page Hits: 0 today (2 in the last 30 days)
Deal Preference: Trade, Buy or Sell
I Trade: Games, Computer Stuff, Movies, Random Electronics, Toys, Other stuff that I havent listed

This user has been reported as a bad trader.

Bad Trader Reports

lakerdodgerfan BTRs16-Jun-2005
Status: active
Reporter: Sid_Ceaser

I'm really saddened that I'm forced to take this action.

On May 24th, Andrew and I agreed to a trade of the following: I sent Andrew 185$ and the Res Dogs 2 dvd set, and I recieve from him a used 15 gig Apple iPod.

We both agreed to send same time. On May 27th, I sent the dvd and payment in the form of a Postal Money Order. Shortly after, Andrew emails me asking if I could paypal him a few bucks so he could mail out the iPod. His email to me went unanswered. Mainly because I didn't have any paypal funds, but also because I'm already sending him cash, and he shouldn't have agreed to mail at the same time if he didn't have the funds to do so.

Andrew recieved my side of the trade (Money and DVD) on June 1st. On June 4th, the iPod arrived well packed in bubble wrap. The condition, however, was abysmal, and nothing like I expected to recive when I agreed to pay him 185 dollars.

The following is all the communications between us via the Trade Proposal System after recieving the iPod. All communication is included. Nothing is omitted:

June 4
Heya. iPod arrived today.

I'm a little shocked at the condition of the unit. Both the front and back are really scuffed up. Its like someone tried to take a buffer machine and use it on the front and back. I'm surprised that you didn't note that there was a dent on the back of the unit. Its pretty noticable, and it makes me a little leary. How did it get there? A dent like that would indicate a drop of somekind. It makes me question the harddrive itself.

Also, on the right hand side of the unit, the bottom of the casing looks like it juts out a tiny bit. Are you sure this unit didn't have its battery changed? It looks like someone took it apart and put it back together again.

THe headphones work, but the wire on the left headphone seems to be attached by the internal wiring. Looks like it could break at any minute.

The battery was dead with it arrived, so I'm going to charge it for the rest of the day. I'm kinda really uneasy feeling about this - mainly because of the condition of the unit; dents, scuffed all over, the right side of the unit looking like it has been pried apart.

I really don't feel it was worth the 185 dollars I paid for it. I was expecting something in much better condition. This looks like it was treated poorly.

I'd really appreciate your thoughts on this matter.


Andrew's Reply June 5th
"Hi Sid,
The Ipod is fine...The battery has not been changed at all. It has not been dropped as far as I know. It had been kept in an Iskin for quite sometim, so it only got scratched. It works perfectly fine. The headphones also work fine, and I was unaware of any problems to them. Don't worry, it plays fine and everything, and there is nothing wrong with it.

My reply back on June 5th:
I'm really surprised you didn't make mention of the dent on the back. I mean, its a dent. It looks like it was dropped, or something fell on it. As far as the headphones go, one side is attached by the blue and red wires that are on the inside of the white outter wire. I seems pretty fragile, and likely to snap with any wear or usage.

I guess the general point being is that I really am not satisfied with this trade, and I'm wondering what we can do to correct this problem. 185 for an ipod that is scuffed totally on both sides, dented, issues with the headphones isn't what I was expecting, and it isn't something I would pay that kind of money for. The thing is in rough shape. I clearly think the price should reflect this, and some kind of adjustment should be made. The thing that really bothers me is the dent on the back. I have no idea about this units history. The harddrive could be damaged for all I know.

Please let me know what we can do to correct/solve this situation. As it stands right now, I'm really not happy with how this is turning out, and something needs to be done about it.


Andrew's Reply on June 6th:
Again..I was not aware of this "dent" on the back. Their is always scratches on the backs of used ipods, this is because of the chrome backing...they get scuffed up over time. If you want I'd be willing to send my Icleaner to make it fair. Im sorry that it was not how you expected, so I will offer to ship you the I Cleaner for free. You may keep it if you wish too.


My reply on June 6th:
To indicate you didn't know of the dent on the back is upsetting. I also get the feeling that you are trying to suggest I'm lying, by calling it a "dent" in quotations. There is a dent. The back metal is bent. Something applied force, or pressure, and caused the metal to buckle.

Obviouslly, as it seems you are ignoring any subtle hit about correcting thisfinancially, I'll just be blunt about it. This ipod was not what I expected, nor was it in the condition I was led to believe it would be in. Thusly, I would like both parties to send back what we mailed to each other, in this case I would mail back everything you sent with the iPod, and you would mail back the 185 dollars and the double-dvd set, and once that is done, we can cancel this trade.

To imply I would like is absurd, and offending. To also try to accept this unit for the price I paid is also offending. To ignore something like a dent on the back of the unit, and then pretend it didnt' exist seems to be just lazy.

I have the iPod back it the box it arrived in. I would like to know your thoughts regarding this matter, and when we can both mail this packages back. Unfortunately, because of the bad taste this trade has decided to leave in my mouth, and after checking your past trading history, now I'm a little scared that if i do mail the iPod back, I may never get my money and dvd back. You seem to have a history of BTR's that I never researched.

I'm going to send a copy of all out transcriptions to the BTR Resolution council as well for documentation.

I expect this can be solved rather quickly.


Andrew's Reply on June 7th:

well exucse me...there is no dent in the back of this ipod, it may be a scratch. big deal. It works. Everything plays fine, there is nothing wrong with it. So, it may be a little scratched, the thing still works. I had taken pictures of it before I sent it, and that is the exact condition, I sent it in. Now, if the postal service somehow caused these mishaps, maybe we should have considered insurance, but if that is the case, I should not be held responsible for something of that nature. Therefore, I should not have to send anything back to you, as I know for a fact that the ipod was in good working order of the conditions i stated.


My reply on June 7th:


I had a feeling you would respond like that. Which is why I went ahead and notified the Trade Dispute Resolution council.

Andrew, the back of the unit has a dent on it. If you run your finger across the back, your finger dips down and then back up again. That too me would indicate a dent larger than what should be there at all.

And, no, it wasn't dented in transit. You packed it pretty darn well to be foolish enough to think it could have been damaged enroute.

I'm shocked that you would now suggest it was damaged during shipping. Way to shun any sence of responsibility. Or to suggest that I would manhandle the unit and then ask to return it. What is the logic behind that? Why would I deface something I just paid almost two hundred dollars for and then try to wreck our trade? It simply makes no sence.

Obviouslly, as I had feared, you don't seem to be willing to do anything about this trade and making it better. I"ve asked for us to return both sides of the trade, and with your last reply, it seems clear you are not willing.

As it stands, you have sent me something in horrible condition, not what I had expected it to be, and you remain negative about the whole thing. I get an iPod that is not worth what was paid, and it sounds like you're going to take the money and run.

Very juvinile.

I've alerted Bill about this, and the DRC would be contacting you about this as well.

I'm really sad that this trade has turned out so badly. Especially now that you resort to calling me a liar and placing the units condition on surpufulous like shipping and the like.

Again, to reiterate, and to try to reach some resolution, I would either like some kind of difference in money returned to make up for the horrible condition of the unit, or we must both agree to send back what we originally sent to each other, and cancel the trade.

However, I will not let you get away with selling me a proverbial lemon of an iPod for the amount of money I spent. Its uncalled for.


Andrew's Reply on June 8th:

I am still going to need proof of this. Because again, I was never aware of any dent in the ipod, only scratches, which do not affect the playability. If you can provide pictures of this then we can talk from there. Until then, theres nothing I can do, as you have no proof. By no means, am I calling you a liar, I am just trying to make sure that this is what it is.


My Reply on June 8th:

I will take pictures as soon as I possibly can and send them too you.

Also, that evening, I sent him the following images, as I had told him I would after taking the pictures myself:

I took some photos today of the unit while I was at work. Enclosed are images of the scuffs on the front, the back, many photos of the dent from different angles, an image of the right hand side of the unit and how it juts out like it had been opened prior, and images of the headphones.

I've emailed the images to Bill and the DRC as well.


No reply from Andrew.


On June 10th, I sent the following:

Just checking in to make sure you saw the images.


No answer from Andrew.


On June 13th, I sent the following:

Once again sending you a message pertaining to this trade. I've noticed you've logged onto the site recently, and have made no replies to the images I linked you too on June 8th, nor have you replied to the June 10th message asking if you had recieved the images.

I'll go a few more days, then I'll be placing a BTR on your account, and contacting the DRC to see what they can do to help.

I've been trying to utilize the iPod the last few days, and, making matters worse, the battery isn't being very cooperative about keeping a charge. It discharges very quickly. It appears a new battery is in order. frown

What a horrid experience this is.


Andrew's reply on June 14th:

All I can say is, that when I had it, it ran fine, had
no dents or whatever, and the battery was fine. All
Ipods have those battery problems, like how the
battery meter switches. My other one does the same
thing, and it is new.


My reply to Andrew on June 14th:

So it seems that we're going to be at some kind of impass then. This is very upsetting.

So I'll toss out the plan one more time: we both send our sides back; you send the 185 dollars and the Res Dogs double dvd set, and I will send back the iPod and everything it came with just as it arrived.

I'm really shocked that you are claiming there wasn't a dent. You wrapped that thing in bubblewrap like a mummy - there was no possible way for it to become dented in transit. And, again, to reiterate; what possible reason would I have to recieve the iPod, damage it to the extent it is damanged, and then ask for a trade back? Its illogical. I've never done anything like that, and I certainly wouldn't start doing anything like that now.

So, lets get this in motion - we'll both agree to send back what we traded, and when that is done, the trade can be cancelled, and we can forget this happened. I will not justify or be content with paying 185 dollars for an item that is in the condition it is in.

I'll give you till Friday to think it over, at which time I'll put a BTR up to help this process come to a conclusion.


That is where we currently remain. Andrew has yet to respond, and, interestingly, and according to the Dispute Resolution Council, he gave his remaining GTZ subscription time away, and he hasn't logged onto the site for the last two days, nor has he responded to my inquires.

Hence, I put up this BTR a day early, because I'm sick of his crap.

To imply that I would recieve the iPod, and then damage it is pathetic. To imply it was damaged in shipping is pathetic as well, as Andrew knows just how well he packaged the iPod - it was encased in bubblewrap. If anything, the only positive thing to say about this trade is how well he wrapped it in packaging.

However, to claim the dent wasn't there even despite all the pictures I showed to him is pathetic.

Andrew - I want both sides of this trade returned, so the trade can be cancelled, and I can forget this ever happened. This has been a horrible expirence trading with you, and I'm shocked by how you are handling this.

I'm not happy I have to put this up. I'm not happy I have to try to chase you down for this to be corrected. I'm not happy you are acting like a little child and hiding from me because of this. I'm not happy that you are taking the cash and running. Very lame.

This BTR will remain active and up. I will only come down with both sides of this trade have been returned.

Poor form. How unnoble of you.

edit He has since given away all his subscription time. He has logged into GTZ on July 3rd, but has made no effort to contact me.

edit - been logging in as recently as July 9th. I'm sure he's read this, and I'm sure he's ignoring this.

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