General

After typing that ^ I actually thought that maybe they will do Bullseye but just not really reference the events of Season 3 a lot. That way, new fans can look at it as a reboot while the Netflix fans can still keep that show in their head canon. Bullseye from Season 3 was more proto-Bullseye, before he fully became what he was in the comics. Being one of Daredevil's biggest villains in the comics, they could easily make him more comic-accurate and go that route while still making it work with what came before, just presented as something different.

When does Kamala Khan Ms. Marvel release new episodes?

bonham2 wrote:

Wednesdays. Ep 2 drops tomorrow. I think we'll watch Ep 1 tonight. I'm only somewhat interested in it based on the trailer, but I think my kids will like/relate to a child superhero.

I was very pleasantly surprised by Ms Marvel. Obviously had very little interest beforehand but I dig the world & atmosphere they’re building and the girl who plays Kamala is great.

It was ok. I mean, it's a fun watch, but it's definitely silly. I liked it better than Moon Knight.

Did y'all see they're bring No Way Home back to theaters with extra content? It's called "The More Fun Stuff Edition". I want to see it, but the breakdown I saw of the extra scenes didn't look that great. Basically, a 5 minute scene of all 3 Spider-Men hanging out is the only thing worthwhile. There seems to be some extra Matt Murdock stuff too, but I still haven't seen Daredevil so that doesn't interest me.

I enjoyed Moon Knight quite a bit. It was so different from anything else in the MCU, barely even feeling like a superhero story a lot of the times, but I didn't mind that. It's nice to get some variety.

Daredevil remains the best MCU TV show to date by a mille, but I’ll probably just wait for the extended No Way Home to release digitally.

Scott wrote:

I wasn’t blown away by Moon Knight the way I was hoping, and that feeling only grows the more I think about it. Oscar Isaac was great as usual and the penultimate episode was awesome, but otherwise it really didn’t do much for me at all.

theJaw wrote:

I liked how each episode had a very different feel to it, and Oscar Issac was just incredible.

theJaw wrote:

Gotta disagree on that one. Wandavisiona and Loki were both incredible and were top tier tv shows in general, not just Marvel.

I liked Ms Marvel, I think we need more fun shows like this and the Spider-Man movies every once in awhile. Moon Knight was enjoyable as a fleshed out back story, but I really want to see more of Moon Knight doing stuff.

WandaVision is a close second for me for sure. Loki was 50/50 for me.

For me:

WandaVision
Loki
Moon Knight
Hawkeye
Falcon and the Winter Soldier
What if?

#1 MODOK, RIP was canceled

#2 Moon Knight

I dunno if this matches what I have on the MCU ranking thread (it always changes), but if we're just going by MCU-produced shows (not the Netflix shows) & off the top of my head:

WandaVision
(Preemptively slotting Ms. Marvel right here based solely off the first episode being a breath of fresh air)
Loki
Falcon and the Winter Soldier
Hawkeye
Moon Knight
(Still haven't finished What If?)

To be honest, I do feel sort of bad placing Moon Knight at the bottom. I mean, it was still a fine show... still better than a lot of TV nowadays, but it just didn't hit home for me other than the performances. Also having Hawkeye above ANY show seems weird to me considering how little I enjoyed aspects of that one, but I had no expectations at all so it at least lived up to those haha. And gotta love a full-on Christmas MCU entry at least a little bit.

So how are y'all feeling about Thor? The trailers have been great so far. I'm really glad Valkyrie is back, and Korg, of course. I'm skeptical about Jane as Mighty Thor. I like Natalie Portman, and didn't dislike her character in the first two Thor movies like many others did, but I also don't see THAT character being a good fit for the role. The trailers haven't really given us much though, just shown her a couple times, but very little dialogue. We'll just have to wait and see, I guess.

I'm loving all of the color in the trailer. The overall look and feel, plus the music and humor, definitely have strong Ragnarok vibes, which is a great sign. I'm trying not to go into this one EXPECTING it to be better than Ragnarok. That's too high of expectations, and very likely to not meet them simply because Ragnarok is currently my favorite MCU project.

I read a thing online last night about how test audiences for the movie said that Christian Bale's Gorr is the best MCU villain so far. That would be great if it turns out to be true!

I'd love to see Thor reach an even higher level of power in this movie, and achieve the Odinforce (or Thorforce?)!

If we're ranking MCU shows, I have to play along. I'm just going to do MCU and Netflix shows since I never watched network shows like Agency's of Shield.

Wandavision - This was awesome. I especially loved all the theorizing as each episode was released.

Daredevil - Seasons 1 & 3 were great. I wasn't a huge fan of season 2 . I really hated Karen Page and the whole Frank Castle storyline.

Jessica Jones - Season 1 is the single best season of any MCU show. If they stopped there, this would be my #1. Season 2 sucked, and I honestly can't remember season 3. I want a big fan of the Patsy storyline.

Hawkeye - I really enjoyed it, despite the issues.

Loki - Alligator Loki is awesome.

Ms. Marvel - So far...we'll see how it goes

Falcon and the Winter Soldier - Enjoyable show, but I was hoping for more.

Luke Cage - Again, season 1 was good. The rest sucked.

The Punisher

The Defenders - Felt like Iron Fist Season 2. Not good, but it had a lot of redeeming qualities.

Iron Fist - So many problems, but it was at least entertaining enough to watch

What If - I stopped watching halfway through

Mom Knight - I watched 3-4 episodes...no interest in finishing it.

Scott wrote:

I'll be honest. I love Thor, and I love Waititi, and I'm excited for a Bale villain, so I KNOW I'm gonna love this movie. But for some reason, my hype levels aren't super high. Could not tell you why if I tried, but I'm sure the movie is gonna be a fun time.

(EDIT: I just saw you mentioned this bit already haha) Apparently, Gorr received the best scores for any Marvel villain during test screenings, so that's something that's got me pumped. I know the MCU has been dogged for forgettable villains (justifiably so), but there are also some top notch villains in there too, so it'll be interesting to see what the deal with Gorr is.

Anyhow, Ms. Marvel episode 2 scared me into thinking they were going to step a bit deeper into the elements of the show that I can't relate to being a 32-year-old dude, but thankfully that didn't happen too hard and what DID happen played into the plot nicely. Really enjoying this show so far.

Ms. Marvel has just been ok for me so far. The first episode was better than the second. I like the overall style of it, like all the animations they put on the screen while real-world stuff is going on, that's fun. My kids seem to be enjoying it more than me, as I expected. It just feels like an average teen show with a tiny bit of superhero stuff sprinkled in so far. I'm assuming that's about to change with how Ep2 ended, but there are only 6 episodes, so there's not a ton of time left. Her powers are unique, but not very interesting overall. Hopefully they'll increase/expand a lot. I'm not liking Kamala as much as I thought I would. Going into the show, I really liked the actress based on interviews and various things I had seen. She seemed like a really sweet/funny kid who loved the source material and was actually getting to be a part of it, awesome. But idk, I'm just not loving her in the show. I don't think it's the actress's fault, I just think the writers haven't made her likeable enough.

Some of this could be on me though. I've been pretty tired the last two nights when we've watched these episodes, so maybe I was just too tired to really get into it.

I finally watched Doctor Strange Multiverse yadda yadda. 4/5 stars, Michael Stuhlbarg was wasted, and

You can tell I don't like kids? :P

Edit: I tried watching Ms. Marvel and the intro made me close the window. I've read the original comic. I know that Kamala was originally written like that. But it's different to read it in a comic and actually hear someone talk like that.

Ms Marvel rules. Best MCU Disney+ show since WandaVision imo (so far). Shame to give up on it so fast.

I haven't given up on it, I just feel I'm not in the right mindset for it at the moment. I'll give it another shot later on.

Watched the 3rd episode of Ms Marvel yesterday. I still feel the same way, it's just, ok. I really wanted to like it more. Hopefully the last 3 episodes can save the show.

Apparently Howard Stern had a hot mic during some ads on his show and accidentally revealed that he’ll either be in or may even be playing Dr. Doom. Not sure how I feel about that one, if true.

https://screenrant.com/doctor-doom-mcu-marvel-movi...

That sounds absolutely horrible.

theJaw wrote:

In a mainline MCU movie? I doubt it.

But in an animated feature or an audio-only project? I could see it happen. There are many different Doctor Dooms in the multiverse (not to mention the sentient Doombot that was a part of the team called the Runaways) and I can definitely imagine him playing one in a What If episode.

I’d doubt it too if he didn’t complain about how grueling the schedule would be over the summer, but we’ll see. I mean, I still doubt it, but who knows.

I bet he's got a bit part doing an interview with Dr doom or something along those lines

"I invented superheroes Robin. Hoohoo."

Did anybody else see Thor: Love and Thunder?? I think I saw only 1, maybe 2 other reviews in the Scores thread. Here are my thoughts that I posted there:

We still need to finish Ms Marvel. I think we have just the finale left. Unless the finale does something insanely awesome, this one is pretty easily my least favorite MCU show so far.

Comic Con Stuff

I think most of the stuff talked about at Comic Con was already announced, but we probably didn't have dates for a lot of them. I Am Groot, She-Hulk, Wakanda Forever, and the GotG Christmas Special are going to close out Phase 4. Next, here's the timeline for (probably) all of Phase 5:

image

I gotta say, there's a lot of stuff in there that I'm only mildly, or not at all interested in. I'm excited for Ant-Man 3, GotG 3, and Loki Season 2. Semi interested in Secret Invasion, The Marvels, and Agatha. That's about it. Overall I think I'm going to like Phase 5 less than Phase 4, but I'll definitely give it all a chance and would love to be wrong!

They didn't include animated shows in the timelines, but we're also getting another season of What If, Marvel Zombies, Spider-Man Freshman Year, and the X-Men cartoon. Thunderbolts is also absent from the timeline for some reason, but will close out Phase 5 on July 26th, 2024.

Now, the big reveal, Phase 6:

image

Obviously there's a lot more coming to fill this in, but TWO AVENGERS MOVIES IN ONE YEAR! I'm really excited to see how this all plays out. A lot of people have speculated that they were building toward Secret Wars and I'm glad they were right. I thought Kang was a very intriguing villain just from the final episode of Loki, and based on what I know of the comics, he's going to be awesome to see more of in the MCU. I really liked how Jonathan Majors played the part. I was starting to feel like they were throwing too many new characters at us with all of these movies and shows, but now that Secret Wars is confirmed, it makes sense. I'm sure they're going to cram a ton of characters into that, maybe even bring back some old characters.

Young Avengers still hasn't been confirmed, I hope they'll do that while my kids are still young, they'll love it.

This Reddit thread has a ton of good info: https://www.reddit.com/r/marvelstudios/comments/w6...

I expect Secret Wars will probably get knocked back to the following year, similar to Infinity War & Endgame. I also feel like there will be another Spider-man somewhere toward the end of Phase 5 or beginning of 6, but Marvel can't announce those due to it technically being Sony's property.

I also don't think the animated shows are on the timeline because they're not technically "canon". What If obviously "could" be depending on whether one wants to think that or not, but it's not really treated that way. Really, ANYthing could be, but if we're going by the "616" universe that acts as our anchor, I believe the animated stuff is off that timeline. It was originally announced that Spider-man: Freshman Year was going to be a prequel of sorts to Spider-man: Homecoming, but then they released visuals of Doc Ock and Scorpion, which wouldn't fit that timeline, and Norman Osborne is apparently Peter's mentor in that series. X-Men 97's Xavier possibly made an appearance in Multiverse of Madness via Patrick Stewart, but I also doubt that show will tie in at all. Interested to see how they handle Xavier in that show though, considering it's been confirmed a newly-designed Magneto will be the "leader" of the X-Men for the cartoon.

I'm looking forward to just about everything in Phase 5 more than I was looking forward to anything in Phase 4, though I did end up really enjoying a lot of phase 4 (while it had some serious flaws throughout). I think that was the Endgame hangover more than anything though - nothing seemed as important heading into Phase 4 and I just felt "well, I'll watch them when I watch them", but now with Phases 4-6 officially being dubbed "The Multiverse Saga" and with the two Avengers movies being announced, I'm back on the pre-release hype train.

theJaw wrote:

That newly designed Magneto was actually his costume when he acted as the headmaster for Xavier's school after Xavier was taken from Earth to heal from some injuries. A bunch of other stuff happened which made Magneto change his tune for some time. This storyline was published before others that were featured in the original show, but it probably wasn't adapted since it relied on other crossover events and characters that were not featured there.

http://marvelcrossovers.blogspot.com/2021/06/the-t...

Ahh gotcha, so it's a comic design new to the show. Pretty neat. Must have missed those issues but I dig the design for sure, though I will somewhat miss the classic 90s look.

theJaw wrote:

It's an era of the comics that isn't remembered very much by a lot of folks, except for New Mutants fans. Magneto was their teacher during this time period, and they show him respect in the current storylines. I only learned about this stuff a few years before the MCU started so don't feel bad for not knowing about them. :)

Secret Wars was my favorite limited series growing up so this week be bitter sweet for me. I just don't see how they can be true to the series. The Beyonder and Doctor Doom are huge parts of that series and I'd be disappointed if they just go with Kang and a few lesser baddies like Absorbing Man, Klaw, and Enchantress. They could have Magneto by then I guess. I don't see them bringing back Ultron either. I know it'll be a good movie but dang, do it right if you're going to do it.

Even the writers have come out and confirmed that Secret Wars was just a toy commercial haha. I love it too but ya gotta admit it was really just a mishmash of cool character designs. Plus the MCU always switches things up compared to the comics. Kang (and Jonathan Majors) rules, so I’m looking forward to what they give us.

Fantastic Four comes first though, so I have to imagine Doom will be involved somehow.

Foxhack wrote:

I may seek them out, they look very fun.

RE: Wakanda Forever. Who's in the Black Panther suit? My thoughts:

I think that'd be very neat, and very fitting given the end of the first Black Panther.

theJaw wrote:

Yeah, there will definitely be a Spider-Man movie in there I can't wait to see all the stuff that fills in Phase 6.

Did you see Feige confirmed that Spider-Man and Daredevil will be handling the "street level" threats?

I'll keep watching new Spider-Man movies for as long as they make them, but after the way NWH ended, I'm honestly not that excited for the (near) future of Spider-Man. It's cool how they pulled off a "reset" for him, but I'm just having trouble getting excited for this step backward, after seeing Spider-Man do such huge things.


I thought I read a while back that Feige had said What If was canon. I could be remembering wrong though.


I actually enjoyed Phase 4 a lot. Shang-Chi, No Way Home, and Love and Thunder were all great, Multiverse of Madness was really good, and Eternals and Black Widow were decent, not nearly as bad as many made them out to be IMO. On top of that, we got a lot of great shows that introduced some new characters and propelled some new storylines. I did have that feeling of "where is all of this going" like you referenced, but I could tell they were starting to build toward something, so I was fine with waiting and seeing. I'd say the Multiverse Saga is off to a much better start than the Infinity Saga. I'd watch Phase 4 over Phase 1 any day, and pretty easily over Phase 2 as well.

I'll give everything in Phase 5 a chance, I'm just not super excited for a lot of it at the moment. I liked Echo in Hawkeye, but didn't feel like she needed her own show. I never saw the original Blade movies, plus I'm pretty sure the new one is going to be rated R so I probably can't take my kids to see it, so that's why that one's not on my radar. I'm excited for another young hero in Ironheart simply because I'm sure my kids will enjoy that (like Ms Marvel), but it doesn't really excite me. I still haven't seen the original Daredevil show and I'm not sure I want to (looks a bit too R for my taste), but I want to be excited about the character and new show, so idk about that one. Finally, Captain America...I've always liked Sam Wilson / Falcon, but his show just did not sell me on him being Captain America, at all. I'd be a lot more excited if he had at least ended up getting the serum and was "enhanced", but a Captain America without the superhuman strength just sounds boring to me. I'd love to be pleasantly surprised by that one though.

theJaw wrote:

I like that idea

theJaw wrote:

If they can get a good, strong actor to pull off a villainous Doom, I’d be all on board with that.

back4more wrote:

Howard Stern already said he did some stuff as Doom... ;)

A video talking about old shows and movies, the proto-MCU if you want

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jhpNqlzWb8I

Best1989 wrote:

I watched those old Hulk movies on TV when they aired. That show is one of the reasons I like the character so much despite Marvel not knowing what to do with him anymore.

Foxhack wrote:

That’s scary :(

I still haven't seen Thor. I guess a combination of a busy life and lackluster reviews lowered my excitement.

I am not very excited for Sue Hulk. On one hand, I like how she's more closely related to the Netflix show world (being from Hell's Kitchen), and I love Tatiana Maslaney. Ok the other hand, the trailers have looked goofy af, and I really don't like Smart Hulk. My guess is he'll probably only be in one episode, although I could be wrong. I hope this one proves me wrong.

Most of She-Hulk's run has been goofy in that fourth wall breaking way that Deadpool ripped off really hard. Nothing would make me laugh more than to see Ryan Reynolds Deadpool show up and get sued by Jen in a trial over it, but I know that won't happen.

bonham2 wrote:

Ignore the reviews and just see what you think yourself. Our tastes have seemed fairly similar, I bet you'll like it.

I would never have sex with anyone not named Mark Ruffalo for the record, this Shulk dog can fudge off

Anyone else watch I Am Groot yet? I had read that they were going to be "shorts", but for some reason I was thinking like 15-20 minute episodes, with unconnected storylines. But no, they're very short, like 4 minutes each after you factor in the brief intro, and credits. There were kinda cute and funny, and my family had a good time watching them together, but they weren't anything special. I was hoping for some kind of fun adventure storyline for young Groot. Oh well. This one easily falls at the very bottom of my ranking.

I'm still hoping She Hulk is Green Ally McBeal with superheroes.

Crossing my fingers.

I'm feeling pretty optimistic about She-Hulk. I think I'm going to end up liking it a lot.

Watched the first episode of She-Hulk last night, I thought it was great! If it keeps up with how good the first episode was, this could easily end up being one of my favorite MCU shows, up there with WandaVision and Loki. I love that it's a straight-up comedy, I like lots of humor in the MCU. I'm glad Hulk is in the show too. Hopefully he plays a big role in the rest of the series, and wasn't just there for the first episode. Hulk's "Smart Hulk" look is much better here than it was in Endgame. They definitely improved She-Hulk's CGI as well, I have no problems with it.

A neg and 0 replies. Love this "discussion" thread!

She Hulk is wonderful so far, I agree. Real fun stuff & yah, the CG is far better than the trailers.

Also apparently the space ship at the start of the episode is teasing a World War Hulk movie/show. That’d be badass.

Well, it wasn't me! I have no interest in it either way. Why am I even watching this topic????? IGNORE.

I was away this week. Just got back and watched She-Hulk. It was way better than I expected. I don't get the online hate. The CGI seems better than the trailer, although she still seems very uncanny vally-ish. I'll say it again...I absolutely love Tatiana Maslaney. I liked the show better when she was herself.

I agree with everything Scott said...and I even plussed you to counter @Kommie 's neg (I know he's reading this).

I guess a couple of the review bombers found our thread!

theJaw wrote:

I read that as well. I don't know much about that, but I know people on r/marvelstudios mention it very frequently. So I'm guessing it's a really cool storyline that could make for a great movie/show, I'm down for that.

bonham2 wrote:

Same here, she's great!


definitely.

Sooooo.....I touched in this in another thread, is it just quips, or is there actual comedy. Thor 4 really turned me off to the quips.

@razeak I answered ya in the other thread lol

How is a quip not "actual comedy"?

theJaw wrote:

I know, looking for a concensus lol.


@scott I guess I mean the non stop quip machine isn't the comedy I'm looking for anymore. Of course it's comedy. It's just I don't know....low effort and kind of mind numbing the way MCU is doing it. Thor 4 just jumped the shark for me, even though I loved some of it (like the Jean-Claude Van Damme homage in the opening Thor scene )

I'll probably give it a go this weekend.

IDK, I guess I don't see the difference. If something is funny, it's funny, doesn't matter what form it came in.

For sure different forms of comedy, styles etc..MCU is in a pattern of overuse. Maybe I'm being too harsh, but the last several films have started to wear on me due to overuse and over reliance on quips and sight gags. There is also an issue with poor tone during otherwise serious scenes or moments that get pointless quips crammed in. They absolutely shouldn't abandon humor, but maybe step back and try a different approach.

Or just know when to implement it better. I loved Love and Thunder but can’t pretend the criticisms against the overly goofy tone are inaccurate. It definitely was more a Taika Waititi movie than your standard “Thor movie”. I’m all in on that but can understand if others aren’t.

But with She Hulk, it works far more naturally. The show was clearly conceived as a comedy first, and so it fits a lot better and is necessary for the character and story they’re telling.

Conceived as a comedy makes me see it in a different light.

I though Ragnarok was the upper limit for goofy. Occasionally goofy Thor is great. Imbecile Thor not so much.

To be fair, I'll say it again, the JCVD homage was perfect haha.

razeak wrote:

This is definitely a fair criticism. It doesn't bother me, but I understand others not liking it.

razeak wrote:

I'd say Ragnarok and Love & Thunder were both conceived as comedies too.

I do prefer Ragnarok/Infinity War Thor over L&T Thor. L&T was partially about how sad and direction-less Thor was at that time, and the way he acted reflected that. He now has direction and a purpose again, so I think the next time we see him he'll be more back to his Ragnarok/Infinity War self.

She-Hulk episode 4 was the best one yet IMO. I thought the whole Madissyn storyline was hysterical. "Wongers, can we get Fro Yo?"

I'm going to have to wait until at least Monday to watch the latest episode. We didn't have a chance last night and my daughter is going to be gone all weekend on a youth retreat.

I've not uttered or typed a bad word about She-Hulk, but my social media is inundated with ads with Anti Complainer/Anti Critic ads and articles. I saw 4 just now after just a few minutes of scrolling.

@Scott It still has to be of SOME quality and good timing even if conceived as a comedy, which is where I think Love & Thunder stumbled. MCU just got to the point I'm shocked Tony Stark didn't make a quip when Peter Parker got snapped out of existence like "Oh...SNAP!" or something else. lol. There are moments where levity is needed in a story.

I definitely have to watch Love and Thunder again at some point, because there was a lot I did enjoy, and my wife hasn't watched it yet.

bonham2 wrote:
The post credit scene was pretty funny too..
This episode also made me feel really bad for Jen Walters simply because everyone is all about her as She-Hulk, but no one cares about her as herself..
Also, the first date she goes on was hysterical...

It was pretty funny when She-Hulk carried that huge guy off to bed. If I woke up in the morning to Tatiana Maslaney, I would definitely stick around.

razeak wrote:

I don't know, Ragnarok had a ton of humor. Based on the trailers for L&T I figured it was going to be even wackier and funnier, so no surprise there. That said, I still didn't think it was TOO funny. The movie handled a lot of serious moments without any humor, like Jane's cancer, Gorr's scene with his daughter in the very beginning, and Gorr's final scene.

Like I mentioned, we've been re-watching all of the MCU in order. I wish I had thought of it sooner since we're already up to Age of Ultron, but I'm going to try to keep an eye out for humor during serious moments. I really feel like this has been blown out of proportion, and it's not done nearly as much as people claim. Here's the thing though, I don't think humor during a serious moment is automatically bad. It strongly depends on the nature of the serious moment, but a lot of the time, I think a little humor to break the silence/tension after something serious happens is fine. To be fair though, I love to laugh, and in superhero movies I'm mostly just looking for action and humor, not super serious stuff, so maybe I'm biased. I saw a comment on Reddit where they pointed out how this is common in real life. A lot of times, people handle serious stuff by making a joke. So why is it so bad in movies?

razeak wrote:

That's more of a Star-Lord joke, tbf.

Watching episode 4 of She-Hulk now. I LOVE the crap Jennifer says during the fourth wall breaking moments.

Maybe not the exact quote but whatev.

Poor Jen.

And I REALLY didn't like that the strong lady from episode 1 turned out to be Titania. #notmyskeeter

Hey David Otunga’s in this episode. That fella was in WWE for a while.