VideoGame_Discussion

Maybe a generational thing but I'd never want to play any of those on a phone.

The problem with phone gaming is unless it was designed for touch screen you really need a controller. And some kind of mount to attach the controller to the phone.

Unless you're going to set the phone on a table or desk and use the controller to play that way. But what else fits on a table or desk and is good for playing games? A TV or a monitor!

Either way, there goes big portability aspect unless you want to lug your controller around with you too.

Maybe it would be useful if you traveled a lot and wanted to play on the plane or something. And you didn't bring your switch or steam deck for some reason.

Apple makes good products but they are among the last companies I would think of when it comes to gaming.

benstylus wrote:

I’m thinking of a Backbone or Kishi to play these games. People lug around a Switch and Steam Deck on top of their phone. Now you’d only have to take the controller with you. I also wouldn’t be surprised if Apple or an authorized third party released an official controller.

The headline here really is that a mobile chip is able to run AAA games natively. That’s unprecedented and is potentially a big deal in the years to come.

Touch controls, even if done well are horrible for me, thanks to 'thumb drift'. Where my thumbs won't come up off of the section of screen and then go back down in the correct spots. So I eventually generally stop activating the virtual left directional stick and either click the wrong on screen buttons, or miss them entirely. So personally I would just have to use a controller.
Also, no thanks on Apple's closed platform.

iPhone 15 summary: https://www.tiktok.com/t/ZT8jYXUdD/

Y'all are gonna need glasses/contacts, and be getting prescribed stronger prescriptions buying all these AAA titles on a small albeit great looking screen

MrBean wrote:

They made a point of saying the new iPhones will cost the same as last year

Staraang wrote:

Unless Apple is going to throw a whole lot of money at publishers, I don't know how many are going to want to take the time and effort to port AAA titles to IOS.

Partly because of the controller thing (virtual buttons on the touch screen are terrible and your hands obscure parts of the screen, separate controller is a potential alternative but may be cumbersome).

Also partly because storage. The top end model will have 512 GB, the base model only 128 (significantly less after the OS and pre-installed apps). RE4 Remake was 67GB. Death Stranding was 55GB.
And with all the other stuff people put on their phones, that's going to become a big issue real fast.

Also partly because pricing. Are people really going to pay $70 for a game in the app store to play on their phone? Does the app store have regular sales like Steam? Heck at least with steam you can play it in the big screen via your computer or the small screen via the Steam Deck. Is there any flexibility in the Apple model or is it phone screen or bust?

benstylus wrote:

Obviously just my opinion but I think publishers will in fact be porting games over in greater numbers. Apple has a huge user base which would be attractive to any developer especially if it exposes their products to a new audience. Developers are attracted to Apple’s huge user base. I don’t think it’ll be overnight. But two or three years from now I could see console-level gaming having a significantly greater presence on iPhone. One of the advantages that Apple has is designing more advanced chips every year which means their devices become increasingly capable of handling the demands of these games. Console manufacturers update their hardware only once every several years.

Storage has been upped to a max of 1 TB. Granted I think in practical terms storage could pose an issue since it’s not dedicated for games like on consoles.

I think the screen size is not as big of a deal as people are making it. People are associating “phone screen” with being tiny. When in fact many portable devices have comparable screens. Take our examples of the Switch (6.2 in) and the Steam Deck (7 in). Is this really so far off the iPhone 15 Pro (6.1 in) and iPhone 15 Pro Max (6.7 in)? Not to mention people have played on far smaller portable console screens for ages.

App Store does have sales. Nothing to stop Apple from adopting a model similar to Steam. Games actually make up a huge part of App Store revenue but I’ve never really cared much since it’s all mobile games which I don’t care that much about. But if they’re going to bring console games on there I know I’d be interested.

Don’t get me wrong, Apple isn’t disrupting gaming today. But achieving this level of gaming with a mobile chip is not a small feat.

I'm hoping more games come down the road.

Most of the concerns don't seem like issues. The screen isn't that far off in size from other portable options, carrying a controller isn't any more of an issue than packing a portable console. Only concern could be the storage and upgrade cost to factor in. I didn't see much on how the quality will compare either to Steam Deck or Switch but if you're on portable, that may not be your highest priority anyway.

lordkaosu wrote:

Agree with all of that. Someone brought up a point to me about cooling as well as battery power. Looking at the stats the iPhone 15 Pro has a battery capacity about 10-15% less than a Switch with the Pro Max having about 10-15% more than Switch. I would be curious to know how much power draw there is with playing these games though. If your Switch dies on you it's no big deal but having your phone die while being out is a big inconvenience.

As exciting as this capability is I'm more interested in how Apple's gaming strategy unfolds over the next 2-3 years. Becoming a serious gaming competitor to MS, Sony, and Nintendo would be a great shakeup to the industry. Those three have run the show for the last 25 years. I'm hoping it'll result in more interesting and creative gaming.

Staraang wrote:

(am I dead to you?)


In what ways? AAA games are hardly innovating, and if they are going to be cross platform with PC and consoles, developers aren't going to want to make meaningful differences in how the games play.

IOS and Android gaming innovations include:

1 - High quality board game ports
2 - Location based gaming (like Pokemon Go)
3 - Making aggressive free-to-play models mainstream (though the model had been in existence on some MMO's, it wasn't as punishing until it exploded on mobile)

That's really all I can think of...

Mainstream touchscreen gaming? DS predates iPhone by a few years.
Mainstream motion control? Nintendo says hi again with Wii predating iPhone by about a year.

benstylus wrote:

Are you referring to Dreamcast? I dunno, I love DC but do you really think it was a serious competitor? To clarify I'm talking console hardware development here.


I'm not really sure in what specific ways, TBH. I'll also concede that it may not amount to much of anything in terms of innovation but it couldn't hurt, right? My post was meant more to refer to competition hardly being a bad thing and could lead to better products for consumers. Perhaps Apple entering the fray will push everyone else to do better.

Staraang wrote:

This is the part where I feel old because 25 years doesn't really include the Saturn or the Genesis.

But as far as arcades go, Sega was still riding high at that point. And with the Naomi and Dreamcast sharing very similar hardware, I think it would still be correct to say the DC was influential and innovative even if it ended up curbstomped by PS2.

Innovations:
1 - practically arcade perfect Naomi (and other) ports
2 - VMU screen (hardly used in practice, but worked well in multiplayer games where you wanted hidden info)
3 - Online gaming on consoles
4 - VGA Output!
5 - um... the cord comes out the bottom of the controller instead of the top! IT'S REVOLUTIONARY

benstylus wrote:

No doubt it was a great system. One of my favorites.

More games have been released for Dreamcast in the past 5 years than for PS2, GameCube, and OG Xbox combined.

Few things are more annoying to me when gaming than
- Touch controls on a game that clearly wasn't built for them
- Having low phone battery because I was playing games
- Sticking a device hotter than the surface of the sun into my pocket because I was playing games
- Getting a phone call while I'm in the middle of a phone game

Apple has been pushing mobile AAA titles since the very beginning when they compared the iPhone 2(?) to the Dreamcast in terms of horsepower. The hardware has almost always been capable of AAA titles, but casual gamers don't want to pay full price for the games, and hardcore gamers probably already have a device capable of playing them better.

The "always on you, super portable" form factor doesn't apply if you need to lug around a Backbone or a controller + mount with you.

Renaissance2K wrote:

All valid points. I don't care for touch controls either. I do wonder how hot the phone will get. Apple has been prioritizing making their chips not draw too much power though of course playing a AAA game would pose a challenge.


That's a very good point. What if it was cheaper though? As in splitting the difference. You keep selling full price to hardcore gamers and then sell for a cheaper price to draw casual gamers.


I don't see this as that big a deal. It's still less hardware to carry than a Switch. People happily carry a Switch plus a phone. If I was serious about portable gaming on a phone I'd probably get a slim power bank as well.

iPhone 2: Powerful enough to play your DC games but PH balanced for Angry Birds.

I cracked jokes like this twitter post about the new iphone, and then asked if they finally improved call quality and not just bettering the camera. (TL;DR = no).

But a co-worker showed me some open-world RPG they are playing on a year or two old iphone and it frankly looked incredible! I can't imagine myself playing a game like that on a touchscreen, with that small of a screen, but it was really impressive.

But I don't want to play games on my ipad either, and the Switch Lite screen is about as small as I can handle due to the use of some tiny fonts in some games (I complain about that too, don't worry).

AR was the big thing Apple pushed a few iPhones ago and nobody really cared. I think the new phone will be capable of cool things but do you really want to spend $60 for RE4 remake in the apple store vs grabbing it for PS5/XSX instead and likely having it be in your console library moving forward?

I hope my AAPL stock splits again in the near future.

Anxiouz wrote:

AR is one of the few gaming wells that still has tons more room for all kinds of innovation. A little sad that it's mostly been limited to either shooting things that are superimposed over your camera image, and Pokemon Go, but I suppose no one wants to take a big risk without a proven product.

Face Raiders was peak AR

AR I thought could go somewhere more than VR but all the AR stuff just hasn't done it for me. I've probably cooled off on it at this point.

Staraang wrote:

This is true. Mobile has almost closed the gap with consoles, and obviously they refresh about 3x as often. It's only a matter of time before Apple does something Switch-like to get these on TVs without streaming. Heck, maybe the new Apple TVs will do it, which could be very soon.

Yoshi wrote:

Agreed. I really hope they do something big with this.

Apple gave an interview to IGN if anyone's interested:

https://www.ign.com/articles/apple-iphone-15-pro-g...

There's some interesting information there but just as interesting is the fact that Apple executives gave an interview to a gaming news outlet. I think it speaks a lot to their gaming ambitions.

I have zero interest in owning an apple device, but I'm all for more competition. Especially in the wake of Google failing and inevitably Amazon.

People buy over priced new phones every year for an absurd amount, only makes sense to capitalize on another revenue stream that's becoming more accessible with modern hardware, and geared towards a new generation.

Razer has kinda playing in the space already, but Samsung will need to largely represent Android to compete.

Maybe this is related to the recent Unity kerfuffle.

With so many mobile apps being unity based, and so many devs threatening to leave unity after the recent "charge per install" fee unity wants starting in 2024 and will apply even if games released before then, Apple might want to be courting big devs who don't use unity to help cover losses when small devs pull their apps off the market

Staraang wrote:

And starting at only $999! And with TOUCH CONTROLS!!!!

FUDGING AMAZING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I can't wait to play RE4 Remake like I've got Parkinson's, especially at that premium!!! Look out, Nintendo, haha, Apple's comin' for the THRONE

Lol, so much hate for Apple here. The game can be played with a Backbone. Sure it’s a thousand-dollar phone but obviously it’s not just a game console. Anyway I’m not looking to defend Apple here. I don’t really care if people hate Apple. I only raised this topic to highlight the advances made with a mobile chip.

I don't think there's actually that much hate for Apple, just for what we think of when we think about mobile gaming i.e. crapty games with predatory pay to play/pay to win pricing models.

We've seen it creep into the console and pc space and if mobile becomes a big player in AAA gaming then those games will be designed even more towards that end goal.

benstylus wrote:


I see what you did there

Staraang wrote:

Paid $200 for a brand new iPhone 11 to use with Boost, it's the best phone I've owned in several ways (other than locked down OS). I think it's not an unpopular opinion to believe 1: iPhones are overpriced, and 2: Games you can't play one handed on a phone suck to play on a phone.

Meh, we’ll see. I’m willing to give it a chance and to see how it’ll be implemented before dismissing it. I think it would be interesting to see if the chip is included in a console or perhaps the Apple TV like Yoshi suggested. Or if an iPhone could be hooked up to a TV with Bluetooth controllers.

benstylus wrote:

That’s a reasonable concern though I hope that game devs would not want to alienate their core fan base be chasing short-term profits.

DarkFact wrote:

The Dragon Quest ports I thought they nailed because they could be played one handed vertical.

As a DQ fan, I'm offended! But they can indeed.

I have in the past hooked up a wired controller to a phone, and then placed the phone on a stand, in order to play certain games. Works great, but once you're going that far, I'd say just get a handheld console.

I did that with an ipad pro once, for science. Played through Super Mario Sunshine for the first time. And I didn't even pay $999 for the privilege, AND the screen made the game actually visible. I'm not doing that on an iphone 15 pro, crap's gonna give me bad vision

Staraang wrote:

Or wirelessly over Apple TV from the phone, I think it's some proprietary ad-hoc standard, so probably less latency than over wi-fi. But they could just make an Apple TV with the same chip as the iPhone 15 Pro and sell it for like $200-300 with gaming capabilities. Pair up your Xbox/PS5 controller and boom, you have a console.

Looks like full scale pricing too

https://kotaku.com/resident-evil-4-remake-iphone-1...

$60 is probably way cheaper than free-to-play would have been

That's what I was begging for, PLEASE can I PLEASE pay PS4 Launch Day Retail prices for the worst possible experience playing this game on the most expensive platform you can play it on? THANK YOU!!! The future is so neat you guys

$60 probably a bit steep for me but I’m guessing the price will come down. RE Village is $30 on Mac so hopefully that will be cheaper. I just got an iPhone last year but I might upgrade to a 16 Pro when that comes out next year. Hopefully there’ll be a bigger selection by then. I think it’s going to be possible to hook up the phone to a TV via the USB-C port and use a BT controller.

Game selection is going to be the most important and challenging thing for Apple. If they can get a Steam kind of service going that would be awesome.

Apparently Genshin Impact is making the Iphone 15 run super hot and really taxes the phone. Not sure sure they are going to be able to run AAA games without Apple fundamentally changing the Iphones design. Then it can also be that Apple dropped the ball with the 15. I mean it not taking much to overheat, it cracks super easy and the titanium back scratches really easy. Nit something i would want to game on.

When I hear people gaming on a iphone or Mac... I suppose phones in general I think of those Viva La Dirt League videos when the guy walks in and wants a Mac to game on.. funny stuff.

15 sucks, everyone got what they deserved, and I doubt they'll remember any of it when the 16's announced. If anything Apple's gonna use this generation to confirm that people will buy whatever swill is put in front of them

I dunno, the phone looks pretty good to me. I think time will tell how widespread the problems are. iPhone gets subjected to exceptional scrutiny compared with other phone and any problem is magnified in the media no matter how isolated. Same thing happens with Tesla even though other car manufacturers hardly make perfect cars. Hopefully the overheating issue will be solved with software updates.

The idea of AAA console gaming on a phone is fairly new so if there are initial issues to iron out I’m not going to sweat it. Hopefully with time it gets more refined. Even so I’ll reserve judgment until we get some reviews in from reputable sources.

Finn wrote:

Relevant: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j-_XcGlBVhU

Skip the preamble to 2:00

It's the Note 7 all over again...

EclipseLion wrote:

Oh well good! Build quality aside, maybe next year's phone won't suck so much!

Genshin Impact making 15 thermal throttle is embarrassing. That crap runs good on my 11 without cratering the performance because of bad temps, because it was made to run on a potato

EclipseLion wrote:

Rich is one that I watch regularly... there is always lots of preamble lol

But yeah it's crazy that they had to lower quality to increase yield. It sure sounds like anyone wanting to upgrade there iPhone should wait until next year. The other thing is the Pro and the Pro max have high speed USB controllers but the lesser phones are stuck at USB 2 speeds simply because they lack the better controller... this will be fixed next year I would assume. It also seems like the glass on the back of the Pro Max is the only variant of the phone that is extremely brittle. I watched Jerry Rig, and the guy had a pretty fun jab at Apple and USB C lol

Even as an Apple shareholder and semi-fan, I feel like all of this is moot until all games go cloud and we can play almost any cloud experience on any console.

Example: I have Xbox game pass and I load it up on a PS5. Sure being Sony brand, any Sony cloud service will run better but I should be able to play any cloud platform on any device. Or Xbox and PS cloud experience on an iPhone. As long as the hardware can keep up.

Isn't that what Stadia basically tried and failed miserably?

Streaming services misunderstand what people want. They want access to the games they bought wherever they happen to be, they don't want access to a digital only platform where you can stream what you buy on that platform. Supposedly this crap is all licenses nowadays by their own words, right? Why is this so hard? You have license, you can play game.

DarkFact wrote:

The other option is they don't want to buy anything, they want it to be part of the cost of the streaming service. Like Netflix but games. Or gamepass but streaming instead of downloads.

That's honestly the only way I see streaming really taking off.

Yeah, stuff like GPU with streaming makes sense too. But everyone's insistent stuff like Stadia deserves to be its own platform. Nope! You'd need Vudu-like pricing if you want that to happen, and vudu-like sales. All the time.

Exactly. If the games cost 1/5 the price, people would buy into the streaming platform. But paying full price PLUS a subscription just to play the game? You are living in a fantasy world.

image

image

Half the framerate, PS4 resolution, touch controls, starting at $1000. Holy crap, I'm amazed

Reading the comments with a bunch of people amazed that a phone that costs a grand can give you a comparable experience to a PS4 game (with terrible controls) is a real eye-opener for me.

[vindicated.gif]

Nobody is paying a grand to play RE. They just seem positive that the devices are getting to a point to do this now.

I don't mind ports to phones but I'm going the other way playing Vay. One of the original app store games and still works on modern devices complete with SegaCD animated cutscenes.

lordkaosu wrote:

Does it have the Sega CD random encounter rate too?

I played through that game but after the first few hours I was so frustrated with how frequent the battles were that I started running away from like 3/4 of them. Was still plenty strong enough to tackle the final boss.

By default the game is easier, less encounters, easier enemies, and easier to get money but there is a "hard mode" to put everything back to the original.

That video is pretty impressive. There’s a good review of it in the link below:

https://www.androidauthority.com/resident-evil-vil...

Certainly not perfect but pretty damn good for a phone. I think adding more RAM to their next phone should make a difference. Also the phone getting warm was another complaint. Hope Apple stays committed to improving and increasing these types of gaming experiences.

Full-scale console gaming coming to iPhone 17 Pro?

We've got mobile gaming at home. I feel like we're trying to solve a stupid problem. The phone is what you use when you're taking a crap; we don't need twelve button games on a touchscreen while we take a crap, we need good one-handed games on a touchscreen while we take a crap. And a self-cleaning screen. And frankly with all the hype-up about how the 15 Pro was gonna be this current gen behemoth, with this as the result, I can't say this is the "Oh my god, you can play Zelda on a tablet" moment everyone was hyping it up to be. At all. Probably because of the Switch. That is, of course, not even to mention the elephant in the room

image

Something that plays the games better, at higher frames, without turning your phone into a furnace and dialing the graphics down to diarhhea levels and looking like a 2013 console. I'd wager just about everyone who claims this is what they want, has one of these boxes in their living room and can already do this WAY better. You know who doesn't want Resident Evil Village playing natively on their phone with touch controls? Your typical iPhone 15 Pro owner.

I hate to be the stick in the mud, I just don't fudging get it. And frankly, I'm squinting at the screen trying to get it anyways because it's so gosh darn SMALL.

It's just not for you and that's all good. I'm curious to see if it really does well or not overall, the market will decide eventually.

The one thing I like is that it's a one time purchase option vs whatever Konami is butchering these days with their properties.

I guess that's question two: This is Village, a game everyone's got either at full retail or paid $10 or got for free, right? Who's buying this again for their iPhone other than to point at it and say "Look, it's on my iPhone and it controls worse than ever!" They've got it at a 60% discount "until november 21" at which point it returns to $40 for some reason.

...??????

Screen size is a non-issue imo. Nintendo Switch screen is 6.2 in. iPhone 15 Pro Max is 6.69 and even iPhone 15 Pro is 6.12. If zillions of people are fine playing on a Switch or any of a number of other portable systems then this shouldn’t be a problem.

Touchscreen controls probably aren’t great I’d agree but can be solved with a Backbone. Reduces the portability of course but still better than a Switch. Not to mention you don’t need a dedicated console or strong WiFi/internet like you would for cloud gaming.

Everyone has a phone already as a necessity so nobody is spending a grand just to play games. This is just another value-add for the phone. Lastly this reduces the barrier to entry for people who may want to play more serious games without having to blow $300-500 on a console.

Enhancing mobile gaming to console levels on a phone also has real implications on people who live in cities where living space is limited. Think cities like Tokyo, NYC, New Delhi, etc. If you have tight living quarters and can fulfill your gaming needs without a bulky console, a gaggle of wires, and TV stand you might be interested in gaming via your phone.

Certainly iPhone is not there yet. It’s in very early stages for this type of gaming but it could get there in a few years.

Staraang wrote:

I'm looking at my Switch OLED screen right now. Are you seriously telling me iPhone 15 Pro Max is bigger than that?

image

DarkFact wrote:

The Switch OLED screen is 7".
https://www.nintendo.com/us/switch/oled-model/

I’ve actually never owned either and never held a 15 Pro Max personally to be able to compare tbh. Just going by the dimensions Google gave me. Also Switch OLED is 7 inches so that’s going to be bigger than both the Pro Max and regular Switch.

You don’t need a controller to play a cloud game on a phone, just someone to better implement neurosky tech. Then you can move thru the game with your mind while sitting on the toilet.

Screen size too small? Simple, don't buy an Apple.

DarkFact wrote:

He was referring to the normal switch screen

ryanflucas wrote:

I'm presuming that'll be iphone 18. I can wait.

DarkFact wrote:

Nah the 18 uses the Hans Niemann beads controller. You'll need to wait for at least the 19 pro for direct mind link.

benstylus wrote:

My butthole is not ready