General

Topic What would you do about this friend?

Staraang

18-Jun-2023(#1)

I had a friend. This guy was my oldest friend. I grew up with him starting in elementary school, knew him for over 30 years, remained friends with him even when we went to different colleges. I rode to school with him in high school, gave him dating advice, played sports with him, hung out regularly, etc. I was a groomsman at his wedding. We lived in different cities for a while but we would still keep in touch by phone. By chance, my career eventually brought me to his city.
We were both excited about living in the same city. I was still unmarried at this time but he had started a family. I hung out with him when I could though it was limited to a few times because it was at a time when I was working a lot. He also had family obligations. However we did still try to meet up when we could including sometimes with his family. I played with his kids and talked to his wife. All of it was quite pleasant.
Close to a year later I was getting married and of course invited him to my wedding which was out of town. He wasn’t able to make it which sucked because I considered him a close friend but I figured he had a good reason.
After my wife moved in with me he never visited us, never invited us over, never showed any real interest in getting to know my wife. He would inquire about her but never suggested that our families should get together.
I know that this will sound foolish but I still would meet up with him occasionally. After a couple of years I had a kid. Couple years after that we had a birthday party for our kid and invited him because he still had young kids and thought they’d like to come. They declined to come to that as well.
I never questioned him about why he was distancing himself the way he was. And in retrospect I should have confronted him about it. I suspect his wife had some issue with me but I never proved that. She did message me a few times on FB when she wanted professional advice.
Anyway for several years I was the only one really putting in effort in the friendship. I would visit him at work or suggest going out for lunch. He was always receptive to hanging out and friendly when we got together. He’d always act normal. He actually wouldn’t blow me off and say he was busy. That’s why I suspect his wife was the one who wanted to increase distance between us.
Eventually I got tired of it. Our friendship devolved to an occasional text. And now we don’t speak at all. It’s been about 4 years since I’ve had any contact with him. Despite living in the same city. A friend I’ve known all my life.
I tried to just move on and let go of it but it still eats at me. At this point it’s not so much the friendship but just the fact that this guy never copped to actually what was going on, why he behaved the way he did. He never acknowledged it.

What would you do in this situation? Should I reach out to him and ask why he behaved this way?

nonamesleft

18-Jun-2023(#2)

I'd say definitely reach out to him. Lay all the cards on the table. He doesn't necessarily know what you're thinking, right?

Reach out. If you do, you might (or might not) get closure. But if you don't reach out, you almost certainly won't. What do you think about reaching out? Would it potentially be helpful?

Staraang

18-Jun-2023(#3)

nonamesleft wrote:

> I'd say definitely reach out to him. Lay all the cards on the table. He doesn't necessarily

> know what you're thinking, right?

I would be very surprised if he didn't recognize the weirdness of the situation, i.e. the fact that he never met the wife and children of his oldest friend? He must know that's on him. I invited him to meet them and he never made any effort.

> Reach out. If you do, you might (or might not) get closure. But if you don't reach

> out, you almost certainly won't. What do you think about reaching out? Would it potentially

> be helpful?

I tend to shy away from awkward situations most of the time which is why I never confronted him. But as time passes I'm not able to let this go. I do think that I should reach out to him. If he's transparent with me I might get closure. I'm not even expecting him to go back to being friends again but I do think he owes me an explanation.

nonamesleft

18-Jun-2023(#4)

Staraang wrote:

> nonamesleft wrote:

>> I'd say definitely reach out to him. Lay all the cards on the table. He doesn't

> necessarily

>> know what you're thinking, right?

> I would be very surprised if he didn't recognize the weirdness of the situation,

> i.e. the fact that he never met the wife and children of his oldest friend? He must

> know that's on him. I invited him to meet them and he never made any effort.

>> Reach out. If you do, you might (or might not) get closure. But if you don't reach

>> out, you almost certainly won't. What do you think about reaching out? Would it

> potentially

>> be helpful?

> I tend to shy away from awkward situations most of the time which is why I never

> confronted him. But as time passes I'm not able to let this go. I do think that I

> should reach out to him. If he's transparent with me I might get closure. I'm not

> even expecting him to go back to being friends again but I do think he owes me an

> explanation.

So, at the least, it would be worth reaching out for your peace of mind?

Feeb

* 18-Jun-2023(#5)

This is very normal. The things that connect people as youths do not often continue into adulthood. Also- speaking from experience- he may be the type of person who will do anything in the world for friends- but has no interest in the social aspects of relationships. Some people do not want or need a deep / constant or even occasional connection with others and that does not mean they dislike you etc

Unless there are superficial reasons his wife has possibly done this- don’t worry about it. And if that’s the case- they can fudge off.

nonamesleft

* 18-Jun-2023(#6)

Feeb wrote:

> This is very normal. The things that connect people as youths do not often continue

> into adulthood. Also- speaking from experience- he may be the type of person who

> will do anything in the world for friends- but has no interest in the social aspects

> of relationships. Some people do not want or need a deep / constant or even occasional

> connection with others and that does not mean they dislike you etc

What you're describing reminds me of someone I know. Extremely loyal. The type of person who values those close to him, and who you can depend on, and will go out his way for you if you needed something, even if you woke him up at 3am because you needed help. But he doesn't like to constantly be in contact. On a weekly basis, totally fine. Daily? Not his type of thing.

I do know someone else who's kind of the opposite, in terms of contact. He'll call you nearly every day just to chat. It's a bit puzzling to me how he does this because didn't you just call your friend or relative yesterday? How do you have more things to talk about already? But hey, it's not like it's a bad thing. I guess it's just part of who he is.

SwiftJAB

18-Jun-2023(#7)

Personally, I'd let it go and move on. If he values you as a friend, he'll reach out one day and you can have the opportunity to talk about all this. Other than getting an answer to a question, I don't think it will change your relationship with him.

Also, until you get those answers and the reciprocation, I'd just give your friend the benefit of the doubt. Since you're no longer talking, you don't know what's going on in his life.

Staraang

18-Jun-2023(#8)

Feeb wrote:

> This is very normal. The things that connect people as youths do not often continue

> into adulthood. Also- speaking from experience- he may be the type of person who

> will do anything in the world for friends- but has no interest in the social aspects

> of relationships. Some people do not want or need a deep / constant or even occasional

> connection with others and that does not mean they dislike you etc

> Unless there are superficial reasons his wife has possibly done this- don’t worry

> about it. And if that’s the case- they can fudge off.

Either is a possibility I suppose. What I found off was that he would take the time to keep in touch when we lived in different cities and still hang out with me regularly but then wouldn’t try to get our families together. I just found that strange since he was a childhood friend. This wasn’t just a random college buddy. I agree with you that people outgrow each other or drift apart. But to make it thirty years and then almost abruptly avoid contact? I don’t know, maybe I’m reading too much into it.

BucketofJustice

18-Jun-2023(#9)

Reach out and try to figure out what’s going on and what happened to get where you are. Could be a case of drifting apart, or like you suspect there may be more. If you don’t get a response, at least you tried. Whether he responds or not is on him, not you.

About a year ago I tried to get together to hang out with who I thought was my best friend a few times over the course of a couple months. It didn’t work out, and I was made to believe that I was the issue, so I cut off all communication and dropped her off every social media thing I had and deleted some stuff I didn’t use anyway that she used a lot. I wish I had communicated better about that, but I can’t change what I did. I did try to reach out a couple months ago, but didn’t get a response, which is fine.

Don’t be hasty and do what I did.

Feeb

* 18-Jun-2023(#10)

I’m the type of friend who would not be happy about being invited to weddings and crap. I’m an butt-hole, but I’m loyal. That’s just me. There are two sides to the coin- I’d rather hang out in a backyard and grill, drink beers etc with a few than be around a group in public. I’m very uncomfortable with those situations. You also wouldn’t be trying to understand my mind, however. I’d let you know this.

DemonAlcohol

18-Jun-2023(#11)

I'm confused by this topic. What is the word.... friend?

Staraang

18-Jun-2023(#12)

BucketofJustice wrote:

> Reach out and try to figure out what’s going on and what happened to get where

> you are. Could be a case of drifting apart, or like you suspect there may be more.

> If you don’t get a response, at least you tried. Whether he responds or not is

> on him, not you.

> About a year ago I tried to get together to hang out with who I thought was my best

> friend a few times over the course of a couple months. It didn’t work out, and

> I was made to believe that I was the issue, so I cut off all communication and dropped

> her off every social media thing I had and deleted some stuff I didn’t use anyway

> that she used a lot. I wish I had communicated better about that, but I can’t change

> what I did. I did try to reach out a couple months ago, but didn’t get a response,

> which is fine.

> Don’t be hasty and do what I did.

There are plenty of friends that I drifted apart from. I accepted that and moved on without any hard feelings. This feels different partly because of how the friendship endured so many phases of life including some long periods where we were hundreds of miles apart. Like I said we'd been friends for 30 years. Now we're in the same city and he can't be bothered to reach out? The only factor that's changed is my proximity to him and that his wife is in the picture. I know I shouldn't assume things but I can't but speculate why he'd act like this.

SwiftJAB wrote:

> Personally, I'd let it go and move on. If he values you as a friend, he'll reach

> out one day and you can have the opportunity to talk about all this. Other than getting

> an answer to a question, I don't think it will change your relationship with him.

> Also, until you get those answers and the reciprocation, I'd just give your friend

> the benefit of the doubt. Since you're no longer talking, you don't know what's going

> on in his life.

That's certainly possible but FWIW we're still friends on FB and he at least appears to be living a normal life. He constantly puts up pics of himself and his family, vacations, spending time with other friends, kids achieving milestones, etc.

Staraang

18-Jun-2023(#13)

I appreciate everyone's thoughtful responses and input. I don't think there's any escaping the only solution which is to simply reach out to him and ask what happened. I wish I could just be like fudge this guy and move on. And that's basically what I've tried to do the last few years. But honestly I've invested too much of my life in this friendship to just blow it off. I still can't help but be bothered by what happened hence my long post above.
At this point I'm not necessarily trying to revive the friendship. I just feel I'm owed an explanation after sticking by him as a friend for decades. nonamesleft is right. When I'm ready I'll reach out to him. Hopefully I'll get closure and then I can move on.

Rollobobo

18-Jun-2023(#14)

I can totally understand how this is frustrating. It would be nice to get a feel for what's changed. I could see how it's definitely hard especially with being in the same city. I definitely like to get an update of what you find out if and when you speak with him. Good luck with everything.

Lunar

19-Jun-2023(#15)

I also think it's 'normal', just a case of people drifting a part.

It's been 4 years, and given the back and forth detailed in your post, I don't think it will do any good going forward to confront him about it.

Tony

19-Jun-2023(#16)

There is a suggestion going around the 'net that you should evaluate your friendships by looking at who initiates the contact and how often. If you are the one who always initiates contact, your friendship may not be that important to them.

I worked with a guy for about 25 years and we had a decent work friendship. We went on a few business trips together (sometimes sharing a room as required by company policy) and, in our last several years together, we went out to lunch together about once a week. Within the year after I left, I contacted him three times and we met for lunch. I stopped initiating contact and I never heard from him again.

KCPenguins

19-Jun-2023(#17)

Tony wrote:

> ...We went

> on a few business trips together (sometimes sharing a room as required by company

> policy)...

That's messed up. Is it the same for mixed sexes? Seems like a lawsuit waiting to happen.

As for the OP, let it go. Friends stop being friends for a number of reasons.

Scott

19-Jun-2023(#18)

I actually had a pretty similar situation with my best friend growing up. We had stayed close into our early adulthood, hanging out a lot during college. After college, my wife and I moved to FL for ~11 years. From then on, I barely heard from him. There was one time when he and his family were coming to Orlando and decided to drive further to come visit us for a few hours one day (they asked first), which was nice. But aside from that, I never heard from him. The only time we spoke was when I initiated, and even then it was very one sided. He would just answer my questions (how are you doing, how's work, how's your wife, etc) but never ask anything in return. The last year or two we were there I was so fed up with it that I just stopped reaching out to him at all. Then we ended up moving back, very close to our hometown. We started making plans with them and another set of mutual friends. It was mostly based around getting all of our kids together, but we also all like each other and enjoyed hanging out as well. However, the problem quickly became apparent, it was only ever us that initiated. If we didn't, we just wouldn't hear from them and none of us would see each other. I had thought maybe he just had no interest in maintaining a long-distance friendship, which I can understand, but I figured once we lived close enough surely then he would show some interest again. But nope. It was still only me reaching out, not just to initiate plans, but even just to keep in touch. I kept it going for a while because it was always a lot of fun when we did have them all over, and the kids loved it, but over the last year or so I've been getting fed up again. I've just stopped reaching out, and surprise surprise, we haven't spoken at all. So, I learned the lesson that I should have learned long ago, and I'm not reaching out to him anymore. If he were to reach out to me I'd talk to him, and if he were to try to initiate some plans, I'd be there, but I doubt he ever will.

Y2k

19-Jun-2023(#19)

It's interesting that so many friendships often 'drift apart' after one of the friends gets into a more serious relationship, settle down, and have children. As others mentioned, there are a multitude of things that can contribute to this. Aside from the ones already mentioned, sometimes the reason is their marriage isn't going well. Many people avoid friends and social gatherings as much as possible during those times, especially with their significant other. A lot of people prefer to keep their issues to themselves.

Staraang

19-Jun-2023(#20)

Rollobobo wrote:

> I can totally understand how this is frustrating. It would be nice to get a feel

> for what's changed. I could see how it's definitely hard especially with being in

> the same city. I definitely like to get an update of what you find out if and when

> you speak with him. Good luck with everything.

Thanks man. I'll update this thread if I decide to do it.

@Tony @scott @y2k I can appreciate what all of you are saying. I've also had similar experiences with a bunch of other friends and never thought a whole lot of it. I do understand life evolves and relationships evolve with them. Some people stay in your life and others move on. I totally get that. I think this particular friendship though is getting under my skin because it survived for as long as it did through everything we've been through and then when I moved into the same city as him he started distancing himself.
I guess I just thought there was some kind of threshold which, after you pass it, you tend to stay friends for good. I just didn't get why he would let go after most of our lives were spent as good friends. Maybe that's where I'm making a mistake in judgment.
I appreciate you guys relating personal stories about long-standing friendships. It helps to know other people have experienced something similar.

rayzor6

19-Jun-2023(#21)

Just my own perspective and I sound like I'm more closer to your friend than yourself in this situation.

My very best friend growing up and I drifted apart and it's completely my doing. He was the most loyal friend I ever had and was my best man at my wedding. Out of any friend I ever had: I never questioned his loyalty to our friendship. He even was going to wreck one of my sister's boyfriends because that guy was crossing many lines and I was in the Army at the time! :D

About the time I had my first daughter, I really really changed. I was focused on supporting my family and being the best dad and husband I could. But more than that, where I changed; my friend didn't. I didn't mind that lack of change, but it was a reminder to me of the person i was before. I'm definitely not ashamed of my friend or our friendship and if he came up to me when I was with business people: I'd bro-hug the heck out of him.

But I am ashamed of the person I was before and I know when someone knew you for that long: the past will come up. I've buried a lot of it and I want to leave it dead. I honestly don't want my kids to know that person. My wife doesn't really know that person either.

My friend and I are both turning 50 this December and he sent me an invite to go down to some of our own stomping grounds with many of the old crew. That was when it really became evident that I want to leave that coffin closed.

Maybe it's the same with your friend and his family?

akfa

19-Jun-2023(#22)

I've left some friends and family separate, sometimes I just want my friend to be my friend, and my family to be my home life. Maybe I'm all twisted up there, but I don't intermingle all of that. Worth noting I'm divorced also, but pre-divorce I didn't really mix that many friends with family, either.

Staraang

20-Jun-2023(#23)

rayzor6 wrote:

> Just my own perspective and I sound like I'm more closer to your friend than yourself

> in this situation.

> My very best friend growing up and I drifted apart and it's completely my doing.

> He was the most loyal friend I ever had and was my best man at my wedding. Out

> of any friend I ever had: I never questioned his loyalty to our friendship. He even

> was going to wreck one of my sister's boyfriends because that guy was crossing many

> lines and I was in the Army at the time! :D

> About the time I had my first daughter, I really really changed. I was focused on

> supporting my family and being the best dad and husband I could. But more than that,

> where I changed; my friend didn't. I didn't mind that lack of change, but it was

> a reminder to me of the person i was before. I'm definitely not ashamed of my friend

> or our friendship and if he came up to me when I was with business people: I'd bro-hug

> the heck out of him.

> But I am ashamed of the person I was before and I know when someone knew you for

> that long: the past will come up. I've buried a lot of it and I want to leave it

> dead. I honestly don't want my kids to know that person. My wife doesn't really

> know that person either.

> My friend and I are both turning 50 this December and he sent me an invite to go

> down to some of our own stomping grounds with many of the old crew. That was when

> it really became evident that I want to leave that coffin closed.

> Maybe it's the same with your friend and his family?

You know, I have a different friend with whom things played very similarly to what you described. He was one of my closest buddies in college. We had a falling out and stopped talking for over a decade. Eventually I reached out and we reconciled. He was really enthusiastic about reviving an old friendship. I tried to be too but couldn't bring myself to do it. I had grown up, matured, and changed and he was just kind of the same guy talking about the same things as he did in college. Some of which I was no longer comfortable with. After that we'd text occasionally and now we don't even do that.

With the friend I wrote about in the OP I feel like there wasn't a real reason to grow apart. We were at the same stage of life and we still got along fine when we got together. My wife and I are nice normal people with nice kids. We have plenty of other families we're friends with. Which is why I just don't get why this guy has acted this way. I will say there are a couple of things that have crossed my mind. One is that he and I are not of the same race. I try not to play the race card but I just don't know his wife that well and it's possible she's racist and didn't want her family associating with me. The second is that socioeconomically I'm better off than him. He has a history of having kind of a big ego so I don't know if he's avoiding me because he feels self-conscious. Third is that I've gotten the sense that he and his wife drink heavily at times - I don't think regularly but maybe on the weekends? That might be at odds with the fact that neither my wife and I drink and therefore they wouldn't be able to do that with us.

HybridCRoW

20-Jun-2023(#24)

I've had similar instances... only difference is I'm always the single one... Most of them have drifted apart due to family obligations, etc... and are excited to get out and hang out when they can to take a break from family stuff, but for the most part I've never really been included in anything (which makes me wonder why do I invite them out??) mostly because it's all couples and families and I belong to neither group. I also suspect they don't invite me because it would be awkward... I'm not exactly a great person to be around socially mostly due to my hearing disability, looks, and growing up not having much of a social life....

Then there's the few friends I had that we were like really good friends, but they got married, had a kid or kids, but then one day just completely stopped talking to me. I reached out a few times, but never responded... I suspected it was more the wife's side of things is why. Funny how my friends always date/marry a woman that doesn't like me and I'm supposedly this great guy...

POINT BEING, well actually 2 points being on my response - 1. I'm a firm believer in communication not just for my hearing disability, but also if you don't say anything, you won't know anything... so I would reach out and take however the response, or lack of response, is that comes to you. And 2. As much as I enjoy socializing and making friends, I much prefer to distance myself because in the end, it seems like I'm just by myself.

rayzor6

21-Jun-2023(#25)

Yeah...I think there is a lot of power in those conclusions you are making. Any one of them would be a big barrier for some.

It's funny you talk about the ego thing...my other former really good friend was always trying to prove himself because he had a bad homelife. He went into the Air Force and actually served directly on Air Force One. Now he runs a private culinary operation in Washington. Has a beautiful young wife and kids, big house, the whole nine yards.

He's invited me a few times to come down but I already know it will be a trek down memory lane (some REALLY bad things there) and while he's good at not being the typical show off person...he'll want me to see all his stuff. He's the one guy I give a pass because while he was allowed to live at his dad's house: he wasn't welcome and they provided NOTHING for him. He was basically an adult with no rent/mortgage at age 15.

Anxiouz

22-Jun-2023(#26)

I've been friends with a guy for over 30 years and now we both have families and by coincidence live 15 miles away. We've done some things with our families but less and less frequently now. Just being honest I don't want to hang out as much with him any more, we're very different people and when we do make plans I usually feel like it's an obligation or a nice thing to do more than a thing I want to do. Now we meetup maybe once or twice a year but otherwise just text randomly.

In my case I'm the one that withdrew from the relationship. We're not the same people we were in high school and as you get older you start not wanting to waste your time as much...so I don't.

Staraang

23-Jun-2023(#27)

Anxiouz wrote:

> I've been friends with a guy for over 30 years and now we both have families and

> by coincidence live 15 miles away. We've done some things with our families but

> less and less frequently now. Just being honest I don't want to hang out as much

> with him any more, we're very different people and when we do make plans I usually

> feel like it's an obligation or a nice thing to do more than a thing I want to do.

> Now we meetup maybe once or twice a year but otherwise just text randomly.

> In my case I'm the one that withdrew from the relationship. We're not the same people

> we were in high school and as you get older you start not wanting to waste your time

> as much...so I don't.

Who knows, he might be feeling the same as you did with your friend. Whatever the case may be I've tried to let this go but I'm just not able to. I'll be going on vacation and when I return I'm going to reach out to him and see if he wants to get together.

nonamesleft

23-Jun-2023(#28)

This is making me think of a good childhood friend I once had. We often hung out, and his family treated me awesomely. Over time, we went to different schools and started drifting. I regretted it for many years because we were pretty close and I think we could have maintained the friendship had we tried. It's not like there was a fight or anything. We just drifted.

So one day I decided I'd try to rekindle the friendship. Decided I would simply go knock on his door, even though it had been years. I went over to his block and walked over to his house, walked past it, and then proceeded to pace up and down the block, willing myself to go and knock. Must have passed by the house at least 3 times. Finally forced myself to do it. I knew once I knocked, there's no turning back.

I finally summoned the courage to knock and the door opened. I think it was my friend's brother who answered. Although they were surprised to see me, they seemed genuinely pleased, and I was welcomed inside. We talked for a long time.

I wasn't able to rekindle the friendship though. You don't exactly have a tool for this sort of thing. Maybe sometimes people just drift? I don't know.

But one day after my visit to the house, I received an invitation in the mail to that friend's wedding. That was pretty great.

At the end of the day, I'm sad that we drifted, but I'm grateful for the friendship that we had.

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Topic What would you do about this friend?

Topic What would you do about this friend?