General

... and back down we go

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lol at this point whatever Musk attaches to himself is going to fail I feel like. He is so obnoxious.

sinnie wrote:

Agreed. He's losing so much credibility and face anymore from where he was. He was admired and respected by many and just kept screwing up his image.

The hype on this has died but it's still chugging along. He helped it at first, and ultimately ruined it. This felt like it may get it back to $.20, which is where I'd bail.

Lesson learned, don't buy a meme stock, while drinking, and buy while it's rising (oh that SNL night still hurts).

I feel like ANYTHING he does with ANY stock should be investigated to be honest (when he promotes it I mean.) He's just trying to fire things up to cause chaos and potentially create hype to make some money. It'd be nice if all crypto had some gains so we could at least break even. I'm still down about $500 and refuse to sell. It's not a loss until you sell! or until it disappears, lol.

Him doing this is hilarious because HE'S BEING SUED FOR ALLEGEDLY RUNNING A PYRAMID SCHEME TO MAKE MONEY WITH DOGECOIN.

https://www.reuters.com/legal/elon-musk-seeks-end-...

Like, how does doing the thing he's being sued for help his case?

Because his whole defense, in that case, is that he didn't do anything wrong at all with Doge. So, him continuing to do that actually kinda supports that argument.

He's been joking about Doge stuff forever. He continues to do it.

I'm not a fan of Musk and I feel like he's really screwed up with Twitter and is being a bit of an idiot about it -- but I actually agree with him on this Dogecoin case. Those suing him really have nothing other than him "promoting" it with jokes and other little things. And their case relies on Dogecoin being a "pyramid scheme". To prove that were true, you'd have to argue that pretty much ALL crypto is a pyramid scheme. And, sure, some may feel that way -- but it isn't going to be proven in court or, if it WAS, then that means that everyone who has ever mentioned/"promoted" ANY crypto coin was "promoting a pyramid scheme." Again, that just isn't going to happen in court.

Musk is asking for the case to be dismissed because they can't show any intention to defraud. So, him continuing to do these sorts of things actually likely adds something to his argument -- that, again, none of this means anything and he isn't "promoting" it for any nefarious purposes.

I mean, heck, they couldn't get anything on him for actually talking about Tesla inappropriately with his talk about securing funding to take it private. THAT actually looked like some real manipulation possibly. If they can't even get him on THAT sort of talking, they certainly won't on Dogecoin jokes and memes.

How is "using a website he owns to make the price of a fake currency go up so he makes money" not the definition of market manipulation?

That's the big deal here: He's using his platform to do this. It's not the same as your average crypto shills doing the same on sites they visit, those might be able to get away with it. But him doing it on the platform he paid money for, which he mostly controls, and where he might tell an employee to boost the reach of a specific tweet - his tweets, which are likely already artificially boosted since he's not really that popular - raises a lot of alarms. It'd be the same as if Mark Zuckerberg started promoting a specific digital currency on Facebook.

Foxhack wrote:

I want Facebuck to be a thing now lol

Foxhack wrote:

Because you have to clarify what you mean by "using a website" to make that happen. As far as I know, he did not say "This is a good investment!" or anything of that sort. It tweeted memes about a joke coin.

A quick Google search shows that one of his first posts about it, just said "One word: Doge." I'm not convinced that is enough to be considered an illegal act. Another big one where Doge jumped 300% (and then fell back down a bunch soon after) is when he just tweeted a fake "DOGUE" magazine cover. Again, I don't see any illegal manipulation there.

Most of his posts are that sort of garbage.


No, that isn't accurate. Musk bought Twitter in 2022 (started in April and completed in October). It became "his platform" then. Most of the tweets of him promoting Doge that he's being sued for were from WAY before that -- like almost two years before that in some cases.


Yeah, if this lawsuit turns out to be ONLY for things AFTER it was "his platform", then I might agree with you some (depending on what was said). But, from what I've seen so far, that is not the case. Their primary tweets are the ones I gave samples above -- both of which are well before it was "his platform."

Even with it being his platform, I'm still not convinced that him temporarily changing the Twitter logo to Doge as a joke is "market manipulation" technically.

I guess we'll have to wait to see what comes out in the case. I certainly don't have all of the details.

I agree with you about this not being the case in the past.

But then he went ahead and did this... if he wasn't getting in trouble over it then, he sure might be now.

He's basically trolling the court now. I guess when you have the kind of money he has, that kind of thing is totally fine to do. I'm sure thr court would love to make an example of him over it if they can get it to stick.

Again, I think he is continuing to do it because his whole stance is going to be that what he's doing isn't illegal manipulation, but is jokes about a joke coin. To maintain that argument, it actually makes sense for him to continue to do this to show that it is him just trying to be funny and not market manipulation.

Heck, I wouldn't be surprised if his lawyer is telling him to keep it up to show exactly that.

I don't know if it'll work -- we'll have to see -- but I'm not surprised at all that he continues to do it if that is going to be his argument.

I mean, in fairness, he kinda tanked the whole thing ... that SNL skit, ugh.

ha, let's be real, our courts won't do crap ... good ol' 45

And, like I said before, the suit appears to also rely on the idea that Doge is a pyramid scheme. I don't see that going over well in court unless they want to set precedence that ALL crypto is a pyramid scheme -- in which case, anyone -- even financial professionals including some very large firms -- who have promoted the idea of investing in crypto would be guilty of promoting a pyramid scheme. I just don't see that happening.

Yea, using your twitter account to express an opinion on doge is one thing, using the entire platform to essentially promote it is another. It's all about perceived reach. I'm sure he'll get around the market manipulation stuff, but this is very blatant manipulation. Guy is a fudging lunatic and the world would be better off without him.

John wrote:

The case seems to be that he's using it like a pyramid scheme, not that the crypto itself is inherently one.

beavis wrote:

Again, from what I've read so far, the suit is about statements made before he owned anything. So, it would have been just him "using his twitter account to express an opinion on doge", right?


That I might agree with, but it doesn't change the lawsuit.

To clarify, what he is doing NOW is more like that -- changing the logo and everything, of course. But I gather that the lawsuit was about many things before he had any control of the platform. So, we'll have to see what comes out in the case, I guess.

Well, none of it matters because it's going down again, gosh darn it. I need to just bail and take a loss and call it a day so done with all this crap.

MrBean wrote:


There's no need to take the loss unless you need whatever cash is sitting there. I'm letting mine ride. I might take the loss for next years taxes and just be done with it. At this point with the volital market it's better to stick it in a high interest savings account (or buy a bunch of stuff you think will go back up at some point.)
I bought a bunch of travel stuff during covid and even though travel is up, it is sort of stagnant, so not sure what is up with that. I'll give it a bit more time. Nothing lost but nothing gained there at least.

@sinnie Even if you want to hold your position you can still sell it to realize your loss and buy it right back. Wash sale rules don't apply to crypto since they aren't securities. I agree with you though that it's probably better to invest the money elsewhere.

sinnie wrote:

Dumb guy speak who's never had to deal with this, and capital losses... But what does claiming a loss actually do? Just lowers your AGI, giving you a minor kickback?

Yep. Lower taxable income = lower tax. The maximum overall loss you can deduct in a given year is $3,000 (by that I mean the net of all of your current year gains and losses is $3,000 in the hole), but the rest carries forward indefinitely until you use it up.

Yeah lower tax. I am looking to take a hit next year so I can owe less if possible. I'll give it a couple of more months before I decide what I'm doing. Bitcoin itself has tried to climb some the last few months but I doubt we'll ever see it over 40k again, but who knows.

Must be nice to be a billionaire and just have people think every little thing you do is meaningful. I think Elon has done great things but at this point is too full of himself to be taken seriously. He's an asshat narcisist.

I expect that he will get jammed up at some point by an off-the-cuff remark that ends up having legal ramifications because he thinks he's joking and clever but it is in fact market manipulation. Whether purposeful or not.

I feel like he already went past that point with Tesla, but no one was able to make anything of it.

Wow... This has to be such an amazing moment to be this guy.

https://www.reddit.com/r/dogecoin/comments/12vfwb3...

Yeah, that guy is a little odd though. Like, the wallet he found has about 1,000,000 DOGE. But he says that he actually bought like 25,000,000 DOGE around that time and this was what he thinks is his first wallet. But then he's not really clear if he has 25,000,000 DOGE now or not.

Also, when someone asked him how he felt when he found it (and even just that wallet is worth about $90,000 US right now), he just answered "There it is". Like it is no big deal.

I mean, that's great if he really has like 25,000,000 DOGE. But this "just found my old wallet" post is, well, weird -- based on everything else he says. Unless he means that he already had 24,000,000 DOGE and finally just found this missing 1,000,000 DOGE more. In which case, again, that's great -- but when you already have almost $2,000,000 worth of DOGE, then finding another $90k worth isn't quite the same. (Which is the only thing that seems to explain his attitude to me.)

In other words, he never makes it seem like "an amazing moment" to him at all in his post(s).

Side note: If he really bought 25,000,000 DOGE years ago, hopefully he sold some last year when DOGE hit 73c and it would have been worth over $18,000,000! Sitting on 25,000,000 DOGE has to feel a bit weird when it has lost 90% of it's value since last year...